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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here is a copy of an email I recently received from SOA in regard to the decision to put a 2.5 liter turbocharged engine in the USDM Impreza WRX STi and not the FJ20.

-- begin SOA email response

Thank you for your inquiry about the long-awaited Impreza WRX STi. Subaru of America is proud to announce our 2004MY Impreza line-up, which includes the STi, an ultra high-performance all-wheel drive sedan!

At this time, pricing and optional accessory information for the WRX STi is not available. This information will not be available until early this summer.

Although I am not privy to information based on the design of our vehicles, I can tell you that based on he critically acclaimed Subaru Impreza WRX, Impreza STi is completely re-engineered to provide world-class sports car levels of acceleration, handling and braking performance. The Impreza WRX STi draws motorsports technology directly from Subaru expertise in World Rally Championship (WRC) competition, and is designed to appeal to the serious driving enthusiast. The Impreza WRX STi is expected to arrive in Subaru dealerships this summer.

We suspect that the original Impreza WRX for the 2004 model year, with its bold new front-end design and more aggressive appearance, should be available at Subaru dealerships early in April.

Please be sure to periodically check our Website for updated information throughout the year. Thanks again for your interest in Subaru vehicles!

Best wishes,
Kelly
Subaru of America, Inc.
-----------------------------------------------------------
YOUR ORIGINAL MAIL:

Why did you put a 2.5 liter engine in the U.S. STi? Every other market receives the tried and true FJ20. I am a huge Subaru World Rally Team fan and I am disappointed that the U.S. version of the Impreza WRX STi doesn't represent Subaru's rally heritage by sporting the FJ20. What were the factors regarding the engine decision? Was it due to emission standards? Or was it something else entirely? Your response would be greatly appreciated.

-- end SOA email response

All I can say is, WOW, what a company line. Up until this point I have always received what I considered to be straightforward emails from SOA, but this one surprised me. I mean the car has been unveiled what's the big secret? I think the USDM Impreza WRX STi engine mystery will never be solved. I am still of the opinion that the FJ20 would have been a better choice, but I will probably succumb to the 2.5 liter at some point.

-Shadow
 

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I'm glad you like the 2.0 better since that is your engine. I on the other hand, have wished for a 2.5T, but I don't have the money. You will eventually succomb to the (approx) 153ci turbo.;) The reason why we get it don't matter to me. I'm just happy to have it available.
 

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Shadow,

Sorry if this seems like a flame..

Are you dotard?

The 2.5 will provide more torque, more HP. The US market doesn't choose to purchase the WRX or the new STI to go rally with it, they purchase it to drive. Your position is weak considering that the majority of WRX owners have been longing for more cc's, I personaly would love to see the H-6 dropped in and either supercharged or turbocharged. And considering past Subaru quality and reliabality, the 2.5 is going to be a "tank".

If you are adamant on the 2.0, keep the WRX, and you will see the difference when I come around with my 04' STI. :cool:
 

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Master Of Pain said:
Shadow,

Sorry if this seems like a flame..

Are you dotard?

The 2.5 will provide more torque, more HP. The US market doesn't choose to purchase the WRX or the new STI to go rally with it, they purchase it to drive. Your position is weak considering that the majority of WRX owners have been longing for more cc's, I personaly would love to see the H-6 dropped in and either supercharged or turbocharged. And considering past Subaru quality and reliabality, the 2.5 is going to be a "tank".

If you are adamant on the 2.0, keep the WRX, and you will see the difference when I come around with my 04' STI. :cool:
take it easy. flame or not, you can certainly find a way to express your opinion w/o calling someone a dotard. this isn't a sand box, and i'm not your kindergarten teacher. so i don't expect to have to post this again.

dR
 

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Its true that WRC cars are limited to 2.0L and 300hp through an intake restrictor, but the majority of american consumer can care less for WRC. Hell, even in SCCA Prorally, there is an Open Class where cars are tuned to the edge making the most of the small EJ20 or even boring it out to 2.2+. So SOA made a great marketing decision to increase it to 2.5L to not only pass emissions, but to deliver exactly what consumers wanted: more power and more low spectrum torque. I also can't wait for them to drop a 3.0L H6 twin turbo into the legacy so that I can make that my second car purchase :D

chris
 

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Dark_Rex,

Once again, wasen't instigating a fight, but I was amazed - no shocked, that someone would write a letter of admonishment to SOA considering all the letters of encouragement and pleas for a very special STI to be delivered to the desires of the American market. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, and I admit that I was harsh. I am under the flu right now so excuse me.

Despite the odds, the STI is comming, and it is a win for the Subaru loyalists.
 

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I have fallen in love with my bug eyed EJ20 ride, and definitely wont be getting an STi soon (that and no $ :D ). I for one can't wait for a STi to ride up next to me on the highway, give a wave, and take off in a flash of blue, gold, and pink(Subaru, what were you thinking?!)

chris
 

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The h6 engine is a pos. I have asked two of my uncles and my dad (all subaru mechanics of 25+ years, one at Flat Irons, another at John Elway and my dad at Super Rupair) what they think about the H6 and why it isn't put into more Subaru's and each of them say they will never own a car with the H6 engine because they are the worst engine design subaru has released.
 

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I've been reading negative posts about this new 2.5t on our club and the others as well. I'm actually sick of reading about it. I'm not trying to be a jerk or trying to jump down anyones throat. I just cant see how this could possibly be a step backwards on any ground. On a performance level, Subaru has done an excellent job. Many other Import companies are envying what Subaru has now done for us. When I say "us", do understand I simply mean the "Subaru Fans" as a WHOLE. This just opens my eyes to the fact that some people are never happy or content. I'm not pointing at you Shadow :) I just happen to post my feeling on this thread. And yes, I do understand the heritage of the 2.0, but you honestly cannot see this 2.5t on American soil as a step in a GREAT direction? Anyone?

Sorry if I sounded like an ***hole anywhere...my apologies beforehand.

Thanks,
 

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My question is, why isn't it sinking in for more people that the 2.5L will be allowed under SCCA ProRally Open Class rules?

If it's rally legal where you're going to be rallying, what's the problem? How does having 2.5L make it any less of a "true rally car"? FIA rules don't matter here! SCCA rules do!

Subaru is taking advantage of SCCA rules in the one market where it makes a difference. I find that not only pleasantly astonishing given the usual oricentric nature of Japanese carmakers, but also incredibly wonderful. It gives Subaru loyalists a definate edge, and that's nothing but wonderful.
 

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What is a "dotard" exactly, is that like a retard?

Master Of Pain said:
Shadow,

Sorry if this seems like a flame..

Are you dotard?

The 2.5 will provide more torque, more HP. The US market doesn't choose to purchase the WRX or the new STI to go rally with it, they purchase it to drive. Your position is weak considering that the majority of WRX owners have been longing for more cc's, I personaly would love to see the H-6 dropped in and either supercharged or turbocharged. And considering past Subaru quality and reliabality, the 2.5 is going to be a "tank".

If you are adamant on the 2.0, keep the WRX, and you will see the difference when I come around with my 04' STI. :cool:
 

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A dotard is actually literally a person in his dotage.
dotard=old dude. It's usually derogatory.
I think he may have actually been reaching for "motard" which is old school: motorhead+retard=motard.

As for the original poster - two things
1. Look up the phrase: "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth"
2. If you're going to email a manufacturer, try to keep their nomenclature straight: the engine is EJ-20, not FJ-20.

I think the majority of us are pleasantly surprised and many of us are elated that Subaru was both sneaky and brave enough to make this move. If you don't like it - don't buy it.
 

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QuickSilver said:
I still say:

(91 octane)+(3 cats)+(American love of HP)+(beat Evo VII)= 2.5L

Isn't this obvious?
My sentiments exactly.

We can thank emissions regulations and octane limitations for our bigger boxer.

No way Subaru was going to be able to keep up with Mits with just 2.0L. I read somewhere recently that the WRX is at a fairly high level of tune already. So, to get a car that will run with the Evo, Subaru did what makes the most sense economically. Tweeking the 2.0L with higherend tunes would cost more and produce less. They already had the 2.5L engine in production. All that had to do was strap a turbo to it and they were golden.

Plus, just think what this car will do with a few aftermarket adjustments ;) ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Master Of Pain said:
Shadow,

Sorry if this seems like a flame..

Are you dotard?

The 2.5 will provide more torque, more HP. The US market doesn't choose to purchase the WRX or the new STI to go rally with it, they purchase it to drive. Your position is weak considering that the majority of WRX owners have been longing for more cc's, I personaly would love to see the H-6 dropped in and either supercharged or turbocharged. And considering past Subaru quality and reliabality, the 2.5 is going to be a "tank".

If you are adamant on the 2.0, keep the WRX, and you will see the difference when I come around with my 04' STI. :cool:
MOP, no offense taken. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I think the USDM STi will be a serious machine, but I thought it would have been awesome with the FJ20. I'm just disappointed SOA didn't elect to use it. I've done some research and from what I gather the decision on the 2.5 liter engine came down to emissions. I guess it turns out that I'm a WRC purist and a JDM fanatic, the latter I didn't know until recently.

I suppose I'll surrender to the 2.5 liter soon. Perhaps there is no real replacement for displacement.

Kage, I didn't get the engine code wrong. The engine code for the WRX is EJ20, and the engine code for all previous STi models is FJ20.

-Shadow
 

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Shadow said:
Kage, I didn't get the engine code wrong. The engine code for the WRX is EJ20, and the engine code for all previous STi models is FJ20.

-Shadow
I've never seen that. Every place I've ever seen says EJ20. EJ is the block family, from EJ18 to EJ25's. Like Honda's B/F/H/K-series, Nissans RB/KA/SR series, etc.
 

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and the engine code for all previous STi models is FJ20
Care to show some proof of that?

A Japanese company finally did something right for the USA. How long have we longed for such exotic, high HP vehicles over here and get water downed versions or nothing at all? Finally, we get a car that others around the world can finally envy and someone here complains? :rolleyes:

And how would a smaller displacement engine, such as the EJ20 be a better choice? Explain please. From what I've heard, they weigh nearly the same. And remember the old saying about displacement...

Mike
 

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Shadow,
The full engine code for the standard WRX is EJ-205
The full engine code for the WRX STi (JDM) is EJ-207

There is no such thing as an FJ series engine from Subaru to the best of my knowledge.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
kage said:
Shadow,
The full engine code for the standard WRX is EJ-205
The full engine code for the WRX STi (JDM) is EJ-207

There is no such thing as an FJ series engine from Subaru to the best of my knowledge.
Check this thread.

http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11024&highlight=FJ20

The codes you site are correct, as well. Perhaps there are some discrepancies in nomenclature. On further evaluation, I think my source of error was incorrect documents found on the Internet (imagine that).

Please remember, my opinion of the USDM STi is just that, an opinion. I know the 2.5 liter is awesome, but I think the 276 hp JDM STi would have been awesome as well had it come to America.

-Shadow
 

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Here's an editorial in Apex Japan magazine that postulates why Subaru moved to the 2.5 l turbo engine (aside from one-upping Mitsubishi):

http://www.apexjapan.com/editorial/sti.html

Here's an extract:
Most of us need something that's, shall we say, a bit more stealthy, a bit more refined. Of course, we still want it to be ballistic-test fast. And Subaru has gotten out one whopping big 2.5-litre turbo motor and stepped up to the plate. For you won't just see that 2.5-litre in the STi, but in all of the Subaru lineup, barring the WRX. It will not be exactly the same motor, any more than the WRX 2.0-litre was the same as the STi 2.0-litre. It will be a rather strong low-to-mid end 250-270hp motor with equal amounts of torque. One that will run forever due to less boost needed to make power. Gas quality issues will become moot for that reason. Gas mileage may even go up since fuel/air mixtures may not need to be as rich.

The reasoning behind all this engine sharing is one shared by Nissan. Instead of producing several different motors for what is admittedly a small lineup, instead produce one boffo motor and offer it in the entire lineup in various states of tune. Look at Nissan's 350Z, G35 sedan and coupe, Maxima, and Altima to see the future of engine sharing. The great thing is that with the reduced amounts of R&D and larger amounts of motors to split costs over, we get cheaper performance than ever before.

Possibly in America first will we see the other variations of this 2.5 turbo in the upcoming Forester. Then it looks like the promised turbo powerplant for the Baja in the summer. And after all that there comes the brand-new Legacy which will feature this engine. They will all be in different states of tune, with different objectives, but the end result is the same. More Power. Already in the STi are we looking at V8 levels of grunt, and over the next few years, we'll have even more engines with stump pulling power from Subaru.
 
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