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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey everyone,

So I've been doing a little reading and I've came across the Civic Type R and to be short, I'm a bit shook. I am not understanding how a FWD 300hp Civic is getting a 7:50 Nurburgring lap time which is faster than a Gallardo, GT-R, 911, F430, M4, M5, and STi. I understand it's light and has a LSD but I am still, very confused. Given it's competition is meant to be the STi, Golf R, etc. I know Honda will price it competitively because nobody's going to pay too much for a FWD Civic at the end of the day so I'm assuming low $30k. With that price, if the performance of that car is what it is, it outperforms a WRX which is priced the same. There's going to be so many of those cars around because they're cheaper and outperform more expensive cars. The only benefit a WRX would have on that car would be AWD.

I know there's other factors that weigh in and this lap time isn't everything but it still has me very confused.

I'm saying this now, if I get dogged by a factory Civic Type R, I am throwing the towel in and going back to practical.
 

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I expect it to be sub 30k. This car will be a big competitor in the market. Like you said, it's only downside is that it wont be RWD. It will be in direct competition with the WRX, the Focus ST, and the Fiesta ST. However, I don't expect it to be powerful enough to compete with the STi or the Focus RS.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
It has 310hp and 295tq so from that number it should compete with the STi and Focus RS but the 0-60 time is 5.7 and 1/4 mile in 14.1 @ 105 which is in WRX territory since it does it in 13.9. What I'm still not getting is how did this car do a 7:50 lap time? In turns I can give it the benefit of the doubt due to the front LSD but on the straight away it should've definitely lost time due to it's power. I'm really interested in seeing what this car does to the market.
 

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Oh my bad I was looking at some old articles. I haven't been as up to date on the Type-R as I should have been. Just read through Road and Track's artice and it appears to be an impressive car. With the power it's putting down, the limited torque steer and the apparent ground breaking suspension it's not all that surprising that it did that well on a track. It might be more expensive than even the base STi, focus RS and Golf R. This appears to be a car oriented for the track and could pose problems to the market. On the plus side, all this advancement and new releases in the "hot hatch" or AWD eco performance cars market may force Subaru to rethink the WRX and more importantly, the STi for another major improvement.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I can't picture a Civic costing $40k+ to be honest. In a business sense it makes sense to introduce a competitive car into the performance category via an upgraded Civic versus introducing a new model since it shares the new Civic hatchback platform and they no longer have the S2000 and the new NSX will be on the pricier end of things. I agree with the force to rethink, hopefully it gives the market a nice boost in performance for your dollar instead of giving more performance and pushing the prices out of a reasonable range. What I'd love to see is Nissan and Toyota embrace the old days and release a Skyline and Supra for around $50k to influence the market and get some things going!
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
A turbo BRZ would most likely be a WRX engine transplant, it would be interesting to see the performance it gets over the WRX since it's 500lb lighter. BRZ-T, STi, Type R, Golf R, etc? Interesting line up, the BRZ would be like a more powerful S2k, though it's still hard to wrap my head around a Civic being included there.
 

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I have been reading many articles about this car over the past month or so and am very excited. I think a good reason for the great lap time would be that hondas make all their power at the top end which carries it through those straights and its only feeding two wheels so it has less drag (per se) than a AWD vehicle. These are just a couple of my guess's. I am really excited to see what they look like in person. If they have decent looks and are priced around 30K which is what I have been reading then I may likely be trading my wrx in for one. But thats the Honda Fanboi in me.

Also a BRZ with a wrx engine would be insane! I am surprised it hasnt happened yet, atleast from a aftermarket/ custom build stand point.
 

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Im sure it can pull those times. But i wonder if a normal average driver would be able to drive a 300hp awd car that well. Its like when people drive high hp muscle cars and get great lap times. But most people would never be able to get those times. I wonder how user friendly they will be

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Obviously the prototype has been released and I'm wondering why no one is talking about this car? I really like the way it looks, but ironically, I'm not a fan of the hood vent.

I keep watching videos from the most recent generation and the reviewers seem to love this car. Also when compared with the STI, it's proclaimed to be a little easier to live with, especially considering the adjustable dampening in "r" mode vs. normal mode.
 

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With the last generation besting the STI in the nurburgring with a 7:50, it seems quick. I would expect them to make the newer one even quicker. That, and even most of the reviews picked the last generation of Type R over the STI on dry tarmac, as well as saying it's easier to drive and live with. With probably well over half of us not needing AWD, myself included, I'm just surprised this thing isn't getting more attention.
 

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With probably well over half of us not needing AWD, myself included, I'm just surprised this thing isn't getting more attention.
With respect, all any of us "need" is about 120hp and whatever drivetrain is sensible and inexpensive to produce. (FWD fits that bill)
However, what I "want" is the drivetrain with a specific dynamic as I negotiate curves/corners...and I've yet to find a FWD car that satisfies. I truly enjoyed the feel of my WRX's, especially after putting a beefier RSB back there.

But I'm a RWD/AWD snob, so you can safely ignore me. :wiggles:
 

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With the last generation besting the STI in the nurburgring with a 7:50, it seems quick. I would expect them to make the newer one even quicker. That, and even most of the reviews picked the last generation of Type R over the STI on dry tarmac, as well as saying it's easier to drive and live with. With probably well over half of us not needing AWD, myself included, I'm just surprised this thing isn't getting more attention.
I didn't think the last generation ever made it to market. It was more dream and less reality.

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It didn't make it to the US market, but it was a pretty successful hot hatch competitor overseas. Looked like a really beautiful car, aside from the cheesy fender vents. The new car looks pretty slick, if not a little over the top. It's a global market car set to his the US.

I probably won't be in the market for another car for a couple more years, but if this does hit State side like it's supposed to, it will be a strong consideration for me. After two years of my WRX and two years of my STI, Subaru's quirky non-daily driving friendly dynamics and terrible interior are going to stray me away from this platform for a while. My 09 Si was probably one of the best built cars I've ever owned, with a very comfortable interior, and very easy to drive. My only gripe was that it needed more power.

We're about into February and we've had one light 2" snow fall and a sprinkling of ice. I also never push my car in the rain, and never push near its limits even when it's dry, especially not from a stop. AWD doesn't really do anything for me. If the new Type R has that nimble fun feeling that was praised in the last generation, with power on demand when needed, it will definitely be in the running with my other considerations (GTI, Golf R, Coyote Mustang GT). The new Si looks 'ok,' but I don't want the farty sound that the 1.5 liter is sure to deliver, nor do I want a motor that small. I just thought this would be on the radar for more people, especially those who seek enthusiast cars such as STI/WRX owners.
 

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Is there a video of the Ring run? There is a small window for actually doing a timed, ring run. The unwritten / written rule is: No video, no time. Typically around 5:00PMish local time, they restrict access to the track. No external cameras, as there may be cars in disguise (test mules - prototypes) and there is a gentleman's agreement. It is held open to around 5:30PM local time and then the track is opened back up again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FrFnrcpBj5k

Al Oppenhieser can be searched and a couple of his videos will come up talking about the Ring.
 
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