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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Good afternoon, Just found this info unbelievable. 0-60 test numbers are from Car & Driver when they tested these two cars.
My friend just bought a 17 M2, ( ordered in June picked up yesterday)
My friend's car:BMW M2 6 speed manual, 3.0 L inline 6 Turbo, 365 HP. 0-60 in 4.4 Sec- Rear wheel drive, no sunroof ( not available), no fog lights, But has everything else- A tick under $60k
My car: 17 WRX Premium 6 speed manual. 2.0 L Turbo, 268 HP, 0-60 in 5.0 Sec- AWD, sunroof, fog lights. I paid a tick under $30k
So....... An M2 with 2 more cylinders, almost 100 more HP and $30k more is ONLY A HALF A SECOND QUICKER 0-60???? Are you kidding me????!!!
For half the money, I enjoy a sunroof in nice weather, AWD in the Winter, ( The M2 will be parked in the garage until Spring) and I have fog lights, a better warranty, better reliability, better resale value and half the money to maintain and repair..... Hmmmm, no brainer. Am I alone on this???
Big
Money
Wasted
 

· Not a mod... or is he? Or, is he not?
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That's a huge margin. However get them on a track and he will likely leave you as if you were parked.

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· Super Moderator (Actually a SuperSpy)
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Am I alone on this???
No, not alone, but you may be limited in your outlook.

I will not buy any German car currently available in the United States, with an outlook toward global expansion of the rule.

Now, with your particular situation, I can't quite relate -- because I don't have any friends -- but I think your friend's car is significantly quicker than yours, and will possibly give you 1sec or more per km (read: an eternity and one day).
 

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You also buy the brand. The BMW will be much more refined and is also way quicker. However I agree, I would much rather go with a WRX in this instance unless I had money to throw around, in which case I would buy both.
 

· In Æternum
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You put far too much emphasis on 0-60 numbers.

All I see is ****swinging.

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It's hard to fault a car like the M2 for pure driving pleasure. But with BMW, everything comes with a price. Options will easily add $20-30K to the price. Plus, as you point out, the M2 is not very versatile--you wouldn't want to drive it in the snow or put something on its roof.

I've had a couple of BMW's--I got them used, after the depreciation had dropped the price to a reasonable level, but then there's the issue of repairs on out-of-warranty Beemers, which is a topic in and of itself.

Though the M2 is sweet, I think, if I won the lottery, I would get a 435 convertible with X-drive--the latest version is beautiful, and can be driven all winter without issues.

I don't think any of us WRX owners kid ourselves that our cars are luxury vehicles, but as far as bang for the buck they are hard to beat.
 

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You are right about the warranty and costs too. BMW recently dropped their coverage to 3Y/36K. Oil changes on regular models (don't know about the M models, where everything is much more expensive) are ~$250, brake jobs are ~$600 per axle. Wheels are RF's--about 50% more than non-RF's.

The X3 I just traded in had a bad LED rear light--the part itself was $200. I had to have the transfer case replaced under warranty--total cost $5000.

Anyway, I love BMW's too and would like to get another one sometime, but I doubt I'll get one that doesn't have an extended warranty.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Agreed. They are money pits out of warranty. The best way to have ANY German car, is to lease it. For 3 years all you're going to do is change the oil and rotate the tires. At 36,000 miles, hand the keys over and say thanks for the ride, before it drains your wallet. They look cool, a blast to drive too. But overall I think they're way overrated and grossly overpriced.
 

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There's no shame in being proud of your car, but your paper comparison falls short of reality. His car has gobs more power from a roll and will be a much more refined and luxurious drive. His car will likely be easier to live with and will have much more power on demand. Apples to oranges, my friend. Enjoy your car and try not to give a sh** about what anyone else has, as least from a comparison or competitive point of view. Take your extra 30k and shove it into your retirement.
 

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My skepticism of anything that is ostensibly mobile yet nonetheless German extends to subsidiaries, incidentally; I will not buy a Ducati (it's not like they were famous for... reliability when they were purely Italian, but now that they've been bought by a German group they're out of the question) and it is with regret that I won't buy SEAT or Skoda either, even though I liked the Leon and the Favorit.

I'll borrow only. I don't question whether they are good vehicles. I question whether they are vehicles on any level, since I do not believe they usually run on their own power.

German vehicles are depressing. Bummer.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Agreed. Repair and maintenance costs on German cars is enough to steer me away. The WRX has enough power and a blast to drive year round. If you have the money to buy a BMW, you got the money to fix and maintain it. I've always been a Jap car fan all around. :)
 

· Not a mod... or is he? Or, is he not?
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When it comes to BMW they are one of the best engine makers on earth. It's the things that attach to it that cause the problems. I'm strongly considering another BMW, but am still undecided. The e60 m5 still screams to me so one day I'll likely have ine

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I will vouch for their engines, at least the i6. And the 8-speed automatic is a thing of beauty. I didn't think I would like driving an auto, but it's impressive and faster than manual.

I think the German cars are beautiful pieces of engineering in all respects including style, electronics and mechanics. The engine and the HP are there, therefore they can they can put as much effort into the design of the taillight for instance as the mechanical parts.

My criticisms of German cars and Lexus, Infiniti, etc. is that they are over-engineered in many ways--all the steering and brake and traction controls, not to mention complicated electronics; with so many complex elements there's more to go wrong, and when it does it's expensive to fix; and they are expensive relative to the performance.

The transfer case problem I had with the 2011 X3--theoretically related to improper coding from the computer--wouldn't happen with a Subaru. There are the horror stories of timing chains breaking with the BMW 2L turbo, leading to $15-20K worth of repairs. So if you've got the money to buy new or don't mind a bit of risk--go for it.

BTW, I would love to lease, but because I use mine for work and drive a lot I put 20K miles on mine every year, so leasing doesn't work well for me. It's better to drive a car for 60-80K then trade to something a little newer.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
The BMW is still going to be better built, more comfortable, and make better use of the power it has, it's also probably still going to run longer.

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See, that I don't agree with. German cars beyond the factory warranty and over 50k miles are money pits. My buddy had an 06 325. At 100k it was leaking and burning oil. 130k a $500 xenon bulb replacement, 150k all new suspension -$2500. This car did all highway miles too. So built better, no. I still say the best way to have ANY German car is to lease it for 3 yrs. That way when **** breaks, it's under the factory warranty and you're out of it before it drains your wallet. I'll NEVER own a German car. Period.
 

· Not a mod... or is he? Or, is he not?
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Your buddy is the rarity. Yes they are expensive to maintain, however if you had any actual experience owning them you would know it's not the engine or transmission that's the problem it's accessories. Coolant transfer tubes, oil coolers, clutches, solenoids, etc.

The other factor nobody really considers is finding aftermarket parts. With companies like bavauto if you can wrench the cost of maintenance goes way down.

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I don't even see why this thread is still going. You are attempting to compare a watermelon to a grape. They are two COMPLETELY different cars from top to bottom. In my mind, just 100% incomparable.

0-60 numbers are nothing more than a immature auto enthusiast's big **** competition.
 
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