Which tune for Stage 2?
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This is a discussion on Which tune for Stage 2? within the Tuning: Electronic Engine Management forums, part of the Tech & Modifying & General Repairs category; I am going to be running a catless downpipe with a cobb sf intake and was wondering what ots map ...

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    Registered User spotsywrx's Avatar
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    Which tune for Stage 2?

    I am going to be running a catless downpipe with a cobb sf intake and was wondering what ots map I should start with? I have heard that people complaining about boost spike, so would it be best to load the low wastegate from the start? I have loaded all three Stage2 ots maps on to the AP. I am just seeing what you guys have been running.
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    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    Run the regular map, then log it several times. And if you need to change it, then change it. Cobb has a video or two on how to datalog and what to look for in the logs and when to switch maps.

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    MAINEiac 11blackSTi's Avatar
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    According to the map notes you really should not be using a catless downpipe on the COBB off the shelf maps. They explicitly call for a high flow cat in the downpipe. Most that run catless will go opensource or protune. 3rd gens have been known to have boost creep with catless downpipes. This is a mechanical issue rather than a tune issue. Some cars get it and some don't. If you do run an ots map with a catless downpipe, you run the risk that you are running hardware that is not designed to be run with the map. If you do this, which I would not advice, I would do some datalogging afterward to see if you are running into issues. It is generally not adviced to go against the map notes.

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    Registered User spotsywrx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 11blackSTi View Post
    According to the map notes you really should not be using a catless downpipe on the COBB off the shelf maps. They explicitly call for a high flow cat in the downpipe. Most that run catless will go opensource or protune. 3rd gens have been known to have boost creep with catless downpipes. This is a mechanical issue rather than a tune issue. Some cars get it and some don't. If you do run an ots map with a catless downpipe, you run the risk that you are running hardware that is not designed to be run with the map. If you do this, which I would not advice, I would do some datalogging afterward to see if you are running into issues. It is generally not adviced to go against the map notes.

    I noticed that on the map notes. I may give cobb a call and see what they have to say about the situation.
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    Registered User Kwrxp's Avatar
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    Get an etune, it will help by giving a tune more suited for your particular car. Tourqed performance is a popular one, and one that I currently use, I have had no issues with them.
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    Pro Manscaper Mikie13's Avatar
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    Yeah the map notes say you need to use catted...however they didn't used to say that back when I had an AP on my 2007 STI.

    I honestly think they state to use catted to cover their asses with boost creep issues as well as legal issues surrounding putting cars on the road with altered emissions pieces.
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    Registered User spotsywrx's Avatar
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    I keep hearing people say everything is fine, some say it has boost creep. I keep going back and forth, not looking to spend a ton of money but want to do it right.
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    Registered User XRedJar's Avatar
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    It may be a CYA thing by Cobb, but I'd assume they've tested enough to know if catless is a good idea or not. I'd be inclined to play it safe and go with a catted downpipe.

    Guess one question I have is what the HP difference is between a catted and catless downpipe?
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    and the Funky Bunch Calvinball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XRedJar View Post
    It may be a CYA thing by Cobb, but I'd assume they've tested enough to know if catless is a good idea or not. I'd be inclined to play it safe and go with a catted downpipe.

    Guess one question I have is what the HP difference is between a catted and catless downpipe?
    I seem to recall it isn't much. Not enough to really notice. Catless dps are significantly cheaper though.
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    Pro Manscaper Mikie13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calvinball View Post
    I seem to recall it isn't much. Not enough to really notice. Catless dps are significantly cheaper though.
    This. It's negligible but its much cheaper, usually by a couple hundred bucks.
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    zax
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    Quote Originally Posted by XRedJar View Post
    Guess one question I have is what the HP difference is between a catted and catless downpipe?
    This depends on a lot of factors:

    1. Location of the catalyst
    2. Type of downpipe
    3. Tuner

    Allow me to explain my statements. The location of the catalyst plays a major role in the exhaust gas flow. If the catalyst is placed closer to the turbo (such as the Invidia Catted DP), the catalyst will be more efficient at removing fuel byproduct but will be more restrictive. With the catalyst placed further downstream (such as Cobb), the design will flow better but be less efficient at removing fuel byproduct. Furthermore, the type of downpipe will play a larger role in the flow compared to catalyzed or uncatalyzed. For example, a bellmouth or divorced downipe will outflow a flat-flange downpipe if using the IWG. Also, downpipes like Cobb or CNT that include a taper will restrict flow. Summary: a bellmouth catalyzed downpipe will likely outflow an uncatalyzed downpipe with a flat flange and taper. Finally, the tuner will play the largest role in dyno numbers alongside the type of dyno utilized.

    The very long story short; a catalyst is always more constrictive than an open pipe. However, the hp difference is an amalgamation of all the factors I've listed above including the type of turbo and boost pressure to which you are tuned.
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    Registered User spotsywrx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikie13 View Post
    This. It's negligible but its much cheaper, usually by a couple hundred bucks.
    That's the main reason I was looking at catless.
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    zax
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    Quote Originally Posted by spotsywrx View Post
    That's the main reason I was looking at catless.
    Be mindful that you may need to PnP your IWG or go EWG if you plan on installing a catless DP on a GR WRX. These cars are known for boost creep...
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    Registered User spotsywrx's Avatar
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    That nonsense they call boost creep....
    2011 Wrx Limited Sedan Silver. Nameless muffler delete, Kartboy Short throw w/ cobb knob, Rally Armor mud flaps, 30% tint... Goodbye warranty Cobb AP v3 and Sf intake. Stink-eye mob #1993

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