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This is a discussion on Change To Syn Gear Oil Now! within the Transmission & AWD forums, part of the Tech & Modifying & General Repairs category; Player- a dude on iclub that has been through many trannies sugguested to stay with the stock fluid. Although switching ...

  1. #46
    Registered User BamBooI's Avatar
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    Player- a dude on iclub that has been through many trannies sugguested to stay with the stock fluid. Although switching to synthetic would be great for about 2 weeks but then it starts grinding more than before you switched. He just now changed to a different type of oil ( I forgot do a seach ), but he had been running the stock stuff for a while.

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  3. #47
    Registered User blarg's Avatar
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    yeah, took it to the dealer 3 times. Basically their story is that the WRX is based on a rally car, not a strip car. if you slam through the gears like you're drag racing the gears will grind. if you're grinding going INTO first gear, like when you're slowing down, that's normal on ANY manual tranny....haven't had a car yet that DOESN'T do that when you try to shift from too high a speed. the only way to keep it from doing that is double clutch into first gear. the problem is that first gear is to much lower than second that the synchro can't quite keep up as well as the other gear synchros. and as far as the whole synthetic gear oil thing....the Subaru mechanic I go to is VERY good....he works on Subaru's and Porsches...he says that synthetic gear oil makes absolutely no difference whatsoever in the car. the OE Subaru oil is a synthetic blend, and since Mobil switched from graphite base to "hydrockracking" a while back, there's really no difference between it and any other oil. You can' rely on it to be stable for extended service intervals anymore, so you STILL have to change it at the recommended intervals, and if you do that, you may as well use the OE synthetic blend which works just as well and is much cheaper...my Subaru dealer charges $19 for an oil change....that's $10 less than jiffy lube...and as for tranny oil...he said replace it with OE oil every 30K miles and you'll never have any problems....his Legacy has almost 300K on it. I was a huge proponent of synthetic oil for a while....but you know what, I put almost 60K on my car this year...about 30K on mobil1 products and the last 30K on OE oil....I've noticed absolutely no difference whatsoever...except the extra cash in my pocket....in fact enough extra cash to put in those underdrive pulleys I've been eyeing for a while...
    ScoobyDMC #009 - making dirty jokes since before you were making dirty diapers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blarg
    go f*** yourself

  4. #48
    Moderator GV27's Avatar
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    I've got shockproof in my tranny and it's great. Shifts smooth as silk. But then I never try to "slam" the car through the gears. I shift as quickly as I can, but I don't go overboard trying to just jam it in. With any machine you have to have a little mechanical sympathy.

    That stuff about M1 being a fraud because they start with an organic molecule instead of an inorganic one is BS. That's an oversimplification of things by people who don't know what they're talking about. That comes from the "more is better" school of thinking. The new M1 is an advance over the old.
    "Inasmuch as ye have done it to one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it to me." -Jesus

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  5. #49
    Moderator GV27's Avatar
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    Check the Tech Reference thread at the top of this forum for more gear oil info.
    "Inasmuch as ye have done it to one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it to me." -Jesus

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  6. #50
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    In general synthetic vs non-syn will get you some increase in efficiency which translates to an increase in MPG.
    Synthetics shine when the temp goes up. So if you engine, tranny and diff see high temps like at track environment, then synthetic should help reliability.
    BTW, which WRX engine does not see high engine oil temps, especially in summer?

  7. #51
    Registered User Natoforces's Avatar
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    Talking Gear Oil

    Originally posted by maury
    What about vibrations/noise when you down shift gears?
    does anyone think that the fluid could be related to that?





    Maury red wrx
    10k
    I put in Motul 300 gear oil a couple of weeks ago and the nasty vibration/noise I was getting has been muffled noticably. Shifting is smoother as well. I have 13K miles on my REX
    Last edited by Natoforces; 11-26-2002 at 06:35 PM.

  8. #52
    Registered User Natoforces's Avatar
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    Excess gear oil removal

    Originally posted by MisterX
    Jim,

    After a day or two of running, I rechecked the level and it was 1/4 qt. high. I took the Mitey Vac and removed the excess.

    Russ
    I had the same problem. After I let my tranny drain for an hour and re-filled with 3.7 qts, I drove it for a 10 miles or so and let it sit overnight. When I checked it the next morning and it was over "Full". I opened the drain plug and drained about 1/4 quart out and it is now just below "F".

  9. #53
    Registered User is2scooby's Avatar
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    Good anecdotes. Thanks!
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  10. #54
    Registered User Natoforces's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Wheels
    Well I changed mine last week.

    And not good.

    I mixed 50/50 between redline 75w90 and 75w90ns

    Now I have an issue with grinding when going into 1st from 2nd. Or from Idel. Im dropping the fluid tomorrow and putting in 75w90ns only to see how it goes from there.
    Give Motul 300 a shot, it is working like a dream. I was forewarned about using Redline gear oil in our trannys (and I'm a hardcore Redline user).

  11. #55
    Registered User jmussetter's Avatar
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    Man where was this thread 10K mi. ago. I had the 2nd-1st shifting problems when the car was new, but noticed it got noticably WORSE when I changed my tranny fluid to 50/50 of Redline 75/90 and MTF. This blend was PERFECT for my last car, and saved a bad syncro for many miles. I'm at 20K mi. now and the damn thing grinds when sitting still going from Neutral to 1st sometimes even! I think I'm gonna try to switch up again. Where can I find this new Redline "shockproof"? I havn't seen it before...

    -Jason
    2002 Midnight Black WRX - EJ22 w/ VF30 and all the other stuff to go with it...

    ***ATTN: Speed Kills! Drive a Honda and live FOREVER. ***

  12. #56
    Moderator GV27's Avatar
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    I actually found mine at a local motorcycle store. You might try that where you live. It's great stuff for 2-stroke dirt bike trannys.

    Subaruparts.com has it. Cobb says to use the Superlight (they have three weights - superlight, light, and, er, Heavy I guess) and that works well in my car, but I never did have problems. My buddy had 2-3 grinding in his 2.2L Wagon and the Lighttweight Shockproof fixed it.

    C
    Last edited by GV27; 12-03-2002 at 02:58 PM.
    "Inasmuch as ye have done it to one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it to me." -Jesus

    1990 Alfa Romeo Spider Veloce
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  13. #57
    Registered User jmussetter's Avatar
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    I talked to a Subaru Tech in Oakland the other day, and mentioned this to him. He says he's seeing a lot of these problems because everyone is switching over to synthetic. He said that the synthetics seem to be too thin to make the 1st gear syncro work well. He said that all the gears have 1 syncro between them with the exception of 1st-2nd, which has a "triple-syncro" in it, and this different syncro is why 1st is the only gear that's troublesome. He suggested that I drain out my Redline, (which I'm gonna ditch anyway at this point) and put plain old 80-90 in it. If I'm not mistaken, doesn't the manual call for 75-90, not 80-90? Did he tell me to get the thicker oil because of this problem in particular?

    This weekend, I went and bought Castrol 80-90 "non-synth". My hand was shaking as I went to pay, I could hardly bring myself to buy a fluid that wasn't synthetic. I'll change out next weekend (hopefully) and see how well that does...

    -Jason
    2002 Midnight Black WRX - EJ22 w/ VF30 and all the other stuff to go with it...

    ***ATTN: Speed Kills! Drive a Honda and live FOREVER. ***

  14. #58
    MisterX's Avatar
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    My first gear downshift problem has resolved itself. I'm not sure tha's good, but the shifting is better.

    russ

  15. #59
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    I'm going to add more crap into the mix & put in my reccomendation for transaxle lube : Goodwrench Synchromesh Transaxle Lubricant. Yah it's the stuff you can buy at the local Chebby dealer.

    I came upon this stuff a few years ago while I was working on Porsche 911 race cars. (my old job). We had been using Swepco & RedLine transaxle lubes on the 901 & 915 transaxles going in customer cars & our own cars. We were still experiencing what we thought was unacceptable synchro crashing due to over slipperyness. Basically the sychronizers would behave as thought they were worn out, grinding etc, long before they were measureably worn.

    This phenomenon, which is well explained at the link to Cobb in a previous post, is caused by the slipperyness of the oil. Synchros are like miniature clutches, or more appropriately, brakes. They require a modicum of friction in order to do their job. The added lubricity of the sythetic based mtl lube was too high, the "brakes" were too slippery.

    Again, we were using lubricants designed specifically for our application: Manual transaxles. Not plain old synthetic gear oil. Synchro crash was still an issue.

    I was complaining to a friend about this one day at the dirt track. He was a GM mechanic & late model sportsman class owner/driver. He asked me if I had ever tried GM's transaxle lube & I told him I'd never heard of it. Seems that when GM introduced the Quad4 engine, the manual transmissions in the Pontiac Grand Prix's were fragging transmissions left & right. GM had engineered atf as the lubricant in their new-from-the-ground-up transaxle & it was being "crushed" by the torque that the 195hp quad4 was generating.

    GM experimented with the same aftermarket fluids I had been using, redline & swepco. Their transaxles stopped exploding immediately, but they (GM) noticed the same problems I was having, synchros not working after a while, especially if you beat on the tranny.

    They either comissioned or made their own lube to solve the problem. It seemed to do the trick. Thin enough to reach all the components that needed it, crush-resistant enough to maintain its hydrodynamic wedge between gears & just slippery enough to do its job with out making the synchros greasy.

    I had a customer's '83 911 in the shop for some maintenance & decided to give it a try. (with his permission) He club raced 10 times a year & had about 25 races on a tranny rebuild & was beginning to crunch in 2nd gear. His tranny was in great shape other than this & had been slated for for a teardown & synchro refresh in another 2 months. I drained out the swepco & poured in the Goodwrench stuff.

    He called me 2 months later to cancel the trans overhaul. He said his tranny shifted better than than it ever had. that was all the impetus I needed to drain the Redline out of my '72 911 & the boss's '76 914. Almost instant night & day difference. I was rdy to pull the tranny in the bosses car & put 1-3 synchros in it & I cancelled my plans. My decrepit trans had practically NO 1-2 synchro action & for the first time I was able to change gears without rev-matching. Not cured in the case of my car, it was still pretty worn out, but it made a big difference.

    They still use it at that garage, 7 years later. Everyone that has switched to it that I know still uses it. Put it in my old Mazda 626GT & it worked great. Same with my previous hot-rod, a Peugeot 405mi16. Same with my old pedestrian '88 dl wagon.

    BIG CAVEAT HERE!!

    Subaru uses 75w90 oil in their transaxles. They werent originally designed to use such a light oil. Neither was Porsche for that matter though, they specified 90w. The transmissions were noticeably (though not arguably) noisier with the Goodwrench lube. Definitely more gear whine. I'd perhaps suggest those of you who are considering a trans rebuild to solve shifting problems give it a try. Those with minor complaints like balky shifting or minor grinding consider it.

    all imho of course,

    j.p.

    silver '03 wagon (only 2 months & I have placed my order for an sti)

  16. #60
    Moderator WilliamG's Avatar
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    Subaru tell me to switch to synthetic at 10k. I'm on 5500. Should I wait or change now?
    2010 SSM STI

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