Selecting Brake Pads - Need Input
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This is a discussion on Selecting Brake Pads - Need Input within the Suspension & Wheels forums, part of the Tech & Modifying & General Repairs category; Looking to upgrade pads and fluid for next year. Recommendations please. I want something that's versatile. My car is the ...

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    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    Selecting Brake Pads - Need Input

    Looking to upgrade pads and fluid for next year. Recommendations please.

    I want something that's versatile. My car is the kind of car that is driven to the track and then on the track. It will be used in 2 or more autocross events each month, 1 rallycross every month or two for fun, and several track days. I don't daily drive either, I drive maybe 100-150 street miles a week at most. Selection seems kind of limited after shopping around on several websites, am I missing some options?

    Max budget is around $100 for each set F/R. These are what I am considering, please critique them.

    -Hawk HPS (concerned they might not be that much of an improvement)
    -Hawk HP+ (most costly, lots of dust and NVH, is the performance really worth it? Decent longevity?)
    -Hawk Ceramic (like that they have little dust and NVH, but how do they stack up on performance?)
    -StopTech Performance (how do these stack up? I like the lower price.)

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    Registered User SubiEj255's Avatar
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    I actually have the stoptechs. They aren't bad for the price. I have heard that hawk and stoptech are the same company, but I can't confirm or deny that. The brake dust isn't the best, but I have no noise.
    A car is only as good as its driver

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    Master Baiter EJ257's Avatar
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    Brake pads are cheap, and easy to replace. I'd go with the StopTechs, personally. A quick squirt with the hose should take care of any brake dust as long as it isn't caked on there too long.
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    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SubiEj255 View Post
    I actually have the stoptechs. They aren't bad for the price. I have heard that hawk and stoptech are the same company, but I can't confirm or deny that. The brake dust isn't the best, but I have no noise.
    Have you tried the Hawks? To give a comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by EJ257 View Post
    Brake pads are cheap, and easy to replace. I'd go with the StopTechs, personally. A quick squirt with the hose should take care of any brake dust as long as it isn't caked on there too long.
    Why exactly stoptechs if you don't mind me asking?

    I can only clean my wheels maybe once a month due to my apartment complex not letting us use any of the outdoor spigots. Even then, brake dust only seems to come off with contact with a rag or something. The ceramics are about the same price and would be worth it to me for the dust savings, but would you know if the ceramics are as good performance-wise as the HPS or HP+? In the end, extra dust is a sacrifice I'm willing to make if the performance advantage is great enough.

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    Moderator   Sasquatch's Avatar
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    I've had Hawk HPS and HP Plus on the WRX. You want stopping power, look no further. They bite hard, in a good way. Zero fade during the track day I did on them and were very predictable. It took me a few weeks to master modulating them for smooth street stops when first installed.

    They are dusty by my OCD clean standards. Nothing a good wheel cleaner can't handle easily enough. They are occasionally rather noisy.

    I've contemplated putting the HPS back on several times, but have grown used to the excellent feel. The HPS would feel quite squishy.
    Moderator for: Dealership, Vendor, and Installer Review, Detailing Forum, Engine Modifications, Exterior & Appearance, Mid-Atlantic States, New Member Hangout, Off Topic, Suspension & Wheels, Tri-State
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    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    How long did the HP+ last? Can I expect decent life out of them?

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    Moderator   Sasquatch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wreckingball man View Post
    How long did the HP+ last? Can I expect decent life out of them?
    They seem to be holding up fairly well. I'd have a hard giving a guesstimate mileage wise, but 2.5 years and 12k miles they still have well over half of the lining left. I do not see much highway driving. These will not be 60k+ mile brakes. The rotors seems to be holding up OK as well.

    They bite hard, time and time again. It's well worth it to me, even though the WRX is largely retired from autox.
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    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    Thanks everyone for the bit of input. It seems to be a toss up between the HP+ and Stoptechs. Price vs performance I guess.

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    Master Baiter EJ257's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wreckingball man
    Why exactly stoptechs if you don't mind me asking?

    I can only clean my wheels maybe once a month due to my apartment complex not letting us use any of the outdoor spigots. Even then, brake dust only seems to come off with contact with a rag or something. The ceramics are about the same price and would be worth it to me for the dust savings, but would you know if the ceramics are as good performance-wise as the HPS or HP+? In the end, extra dust is a sacrifice I'm willing to make if the performance advantage is great enough.
    Brake fade on the street isn't an issue; if it is, you need to re-evaluate your driving habits.
    Brake fade on an Auto-X course usually isn't an issue; typically, runs are in the ~30 second range, and not that big of a deal.

    I would go with StopTechs for a double-duty pad. If you get into longer Auto-X courses or HPDEs, then going with something like the HP+ may be more up your alley, but I would spend money on SS lines, master cylinder brace, and fluid before really thinking too much about brake compound.

    I never competed in Auto-X (my modifications put me in a class with people who had $100K STIs). I would go there and have a fun day hoping to improve my time throughout the day and push my car to the limit in a controlled environment. I never needed the best stuff, and I was content with it. I ran ACDelco (OE on the Corvette) and StopTech Posi-Quiet pads when I was doing it (still have the PQs on). If I ever felt the need to go beyond what the StopTechs offered, I'd be on the Ferodo DS2500 line, hands down.

    I don't have a comparison of HP+ vs ST, but MSRP for STs on my car is ~$135, HP+ is ~$300. I've driven enough ST-pad cars (both the street performance and PQ line) to be happy with what I get.
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    Having been a lurker on the site for many years, I finally decided to register and share rather than just sucking knowledge...
    I have a mostly stock WRX- Yokohama AD08 tires (certainly the best investment), and a snug fitting Sparco "tuning" seat (a close second). I do about 12-18 track days a year and my WRX doubles as the daddy shuttle... I'm not a very finesse type driver- I just stand on the brake pedal for Turn 2 at Laguna, 11 at Sonoma etc...and my pads only make it 3-4 track days... yeah I'm going to go take some classes and figure out how to drive...
    I use ATE 200 brake fluid that I flush each year, my brake lines are stock and I use the least expensive blank rotors. With that in mind:
    I first graduated from my stock pads to the Stop Tech 309/ street performance. I would have to say they were inexpensive, had better fade resistance than stock pads (they went about 4 hot laps at Laguna Seca or Thunderhill), dusted somewhat more than the stock pads, and were completely quiet. I ran them for several years.
    I next moved on to Ferrodo DS2500 after much debate and comparison on various websites and forums. I would have to say to say they were a modest increase in fade resistance over the Stop Techs, maybe I got one more hot lap in, but they dusted a bit more, and were 140 bucks a pair (as compared to 55 for the Stop Techs). They too were completely quiet for me, though several owners on other posts reported that they squealed...(I'm not sure if this is related to an incomplete bedding procedure on their part, or just my good luck...I only ran one pair of them then moved on)
    I'm now running the Hawk HP Plus. The rating on the pads is a GG (as compared to the FF rating of the other two) and they are quite different from the other two as expected. I noticed the stopping power- I'm not sure if "bite" is quite the right word, but they scrub off speed quick. If you STEP on the stop pedal...you need to look in the rear view mirror and who is bearing down on you =(. The fade resistance is also much improved. I can go a good 15 minutes of hot lapping before fade sets in. They dust considerably more than the stock or either of the above pads (not even close) and finally, they do make a single frequency squeal. It's not the sound of a bus stopping as I've heard others describe and it turns out to be something I can live with...and I HATE dashboard rattle, if that gives you some perspective. In all- I'll probably be in the Hawk HP plus until I make the leap to the "track only car"...

  12. #11
    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    Hey guys. Haven't been as active as I used to on this site. A few weeks ago my brakes finally gave way and the opportunity to upgrade arose. I literally drove them down to the metal on the pads since the old rotors were too thin to be turned again.

    So what I went with was pretty much a stock replacement with some better pads. I couldn't bring myself to spend so much on brakes to get Ferodos, which I really had my heart set on recently. Nor was I willing to fork over for DBA rotors. Not to mention I truly didn't need them and it would almost defeat my new philosophy and my goals for this car. The point of the purchase was to get back on the road and stack up more miles of fun all while keeping the price low, quality similar to OEM, and maybe catch a little upgrade while the opportunity was there.

    I got Stoptech street performance pads and Centric premium replacement rotors. Hopefully I'll get some good bite out of these pads and the rotors look great with the rust-coating they put on them. I'll post an update here after I drive on them for awhile.

    thanks guys
    -the wreckingball

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    The Jedi Ninja TownLine500's Avatar
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    Nice!
    New brakes just in time for modding season.
    Good to see you posting Bro lol.
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    Admiral Ackbar the 1st mycologist's Avatar
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    I have tried Axis Ultimates and EBC Red Stuff. I like the EBC sooo much I am using them on all our cars from now on. The regular street pads for the Outback wagon completely cured it of the vibration my wife would always develop driving an auto trans. in the mountains.

    The Red stuff have great bite and feel, work well cold, are civilized in all conditions, and don't dust badly at all. I'm not sure why more here don't choose them - they are higher heat range than the Hawk HP + or Stoptech. They come with a bedding compound on top too. And they don't come with the noise and dust the HP + are reported to have.

    It is hard to get clear #s but from what I can tell
    YellowStuff MOT 1750F
    Redstuff MOT 1400F but work well cold
    StopTech MOT 1300F
    Hawk HP + MOT 900F

    Very true to my experience:
    http://www.evolutionm.net/forums/evo...ow-review.html
    Last edited by mycologist; 04-24-2015 at 02:06 PM.
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