Mixed feeling
+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 18

This is a discussion on Mixed feeling within the New Member Hangout forums, part of the Community - Meet other Enthusiasts category; Hey everyone. It's more than 2 months owning my '11 WRX. Last week I got the chance to drive it ...

  1. #1
    Registered User BANSwee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    cleveland
    Posts
    131

    Mixed feeling

    Hey everyone. It's more than 2 months owning my '11 WRX. Last week I got the chance to drive it on a snow covered road (say 5-8 inch snow). Much to much surprise I got this drifting style drive. Whenever I am on a curve I would try to understeer the car so I can compensate but it would always give this oversteer. This is actually "fun" BUT if my wife is on-board she would probably have a heart attack.. God forbid!..

    So, anyway how do we correct this. I have a CR-v prior to this WRX but I don't have such scenario. HOnda call it 'real-time 4WD', it only engages the 4WD on slippage. I believe our WRX is full time 50-50 power split. Also worth noting are my tires, I have a conti extreme DWS (all season).

    Suggestions/recommendation appreciated!


    Thanks
    2011 WRX HB in WR blue

    budding audiophile

  2. Remove Advertisements
    ClubWRX.net
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    Registered User poly_poly-man's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Rochester Institvte of Technorcery
    Posts
    1,223
    all-season tires are universally terrible in all seasons (hence the name). If you actually want to go out in snow like that, do the rest of us a favor and get some good winter tires.
    My big thread: The Used WRX Buying Checklist - Please Contribute!

    My current car: 2002 WRB WRX Wagon.
    Mods: GM BCS, Carberry SD rom, uppipe, AEM UEGO, Klunk Killer, F+R shifter bushings, head unit

  4. #3
    Registered User 06scoobyrex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    SL,UT
    Posts
    2,606
    Bizzaks (or anyother winter tire) and weight in the back... I have a sub woofer box with 2 10's and an amp plus 2 50lb bags of rock salt in my trunk... I only have A/S's too, but the extra weight helps too...
    Hawk-Eye Alliance #801
    The Impreza "this was repaired/replaced at what mileage" database (Please Contribute)
    http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/showth...57#post2688257

  5. #4
    Registered User lytlec's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Central PA
    Posts
    4,312
    Quote Originally Posted by 06scoobyrex View Post
    Bizzaks (or anyother winter tire) and weight in the back... I have a sub woofer box with 2 10's and an amp plus 2 50lb bags of rock salt in my trunk... I only have A/S's too, but the extra weight helps too...
    Extra weight...I used to do that when I had my focus. Haven't with the wrx yet...
    <-------- Taylor Swift.
    2006 WRX 330whp. 300wtq. Slow.
    Hawk-Eye Alliance #137
    First Mods...what to do.
    Subaru Guide

  6. #5
    Registered User 06scoobyrex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    SL,UT
    Posts
    2,606
    Quote Originally Posted by lytlec View Post
    Extra weight...I used to do that when I had my focus. Haven't with the wrx yet...
    I did this with my old Z28 with 6 bags in the back hatch and studded snow tires and ikt was the only safe way to get through the snow... the fastest I dare go was about 40 mile per hour, but its better then driving in circles...lol
    Hawk-Eye Alliance #801
    The Impreza "this was repaired/replaced at what mileage" database (Please Contribute)
    http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/showth...57#post2688257

  7. #6
    Mace Windu devilfluff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    south jersey
    Posts
    6,284
    I Support ClubWRX
    Best suggestion:

    Slow down.

    If that doesn't work, get some winter tires.
    Dirty Jersey
    Part-Time Grammar Nazi
    RIP- '02 PSM Wagon
    08 Candy White MK5 GTI 6spd

    Moderator:Tri-State and Transmission & AWD forums

  8. #7
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    India
    Posts
    1
    It has more weight.

  9. #8
    zax
    zax is online now
    \_(ツ)_/ zax's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Neverland Ranch, Maryland
    Posts
    13,407
    I Support ClubWRX I Support ClubWRX
    AWD helps with traction, but IT ISN'T MAGIC. You will slide in the snow regardless of drive type. It's simple physics ... you have 4 patches contacting the snow. If you overcome the coefficient of friction your car will slide regardless of whether the car is 4 wheel drive or 1 wheel drive. What can you do? Increase the coefficient of friction... that is, invest in some good winter tires. /thread


    Actually, this is the reason why you see predominantly 4wd cars/trucks in the ditches during winter storms. Drivers apparently think that 4wd has some magic to keep the car on the road. Jesse is right, your best bet is to slow down. Stability control, AYC, limited slip diffs, active center diffs all help maintain control, but they cannot stop the car from sliding when the friction is lost, remember that...
    2015 CWP WRX STi ... But how did I get roped back into an EJ motor?!
    Zax's utterly unimaginably stock 2015 STi build thread
    Zax's Shaggin' Wagon Build Thread Now tuned for 99% pure Unicorn Jizz!

    Zach | Moderator -- Mid-Atlantic States, Tech & Modifying & General Repairs
    Rollin' with the Bugeye Mafia #302 | N.E.R.D. Subject Zero
    Facebook me here

    Your Mid-A local board: http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/mid-atlantic-states/

  10. #9
    \_(ツ)_/ Rambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    5,127
    I Support ClubWRX
    Quote Originally Posted by zax View Post
    AWD helps with traction, but IT ISN'T MAGIC. You will slide in the snow regardless of drive type. It's simple physics ... you have 4 patches contacting the snow. If you overcome the coefficient of friction your car will slide regardless of whether the car is 4 wheel drive or 1 wheel drive. What can you do? Increase the coefficient of friction... that is, invest in some good winter tires. /thread


    Actually, this is the reason why you see predominantly 4wd cars/trucks in the ditches during winter storms. Drivers apparently think that 4wd has some magic to keep the car on the road. Jesse is right, your best bet is to slow down. Stability control, AYC, limited slip diffs, active center diffs all help maintain control, but they cannot stop the car from sliding when the friction is lost, remember that...
    +1

    Last winter, I was driving through a snowy pass where the police required chains or snow tires and were checking every car. A guy in his lowered Audi was absolutely irate, insisting his car had Quattro and was good to go, even though his tires were practically racing slicks. Somehow, he managed to get through the blockade, drove off like a maniac, and... ended up in in a ditch 5 miles later.

    I really like the surefooted handling and traction of my subie, but I know my tires and driving style have the greatest impact on traction.

    Sent from my Eris using Tapatalk
    Isaac -- 2003 WRX sedan Stg II - Gave its life for mine 6/2013.
    2007 Outback 3.0R wagon
    Proud owner of a N.E.R.D, Member 1.3810-23

    The pursuit of knowledge is hopeless and eternal... Hooray!!! - Professor Farnsworth

  11. #10
    Pro Manscaper Mikie13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Palmyra, NJ
    Posts
    21,190
    It *doesn't* matter what kind of tires you have on the car...if you drive to the ability that the car has to safely handle the weather, then you're good.

    I starred "doesn't" simply because I had an 07 STI with the stock Potenzas, which are Summer high performance tires, and really don't belong in the winter weather. However I knew I shouldn't push them to do thing I knew they weren't made for and I survived with some decent commutes, simply because I just wanted to be safe. However, getting winter tires greatly improves the winter handling, so its a great suggestion to heed.

    Slow down, and you'll be a lot better off.
    The Hawk-Eye Alliance #90|The Blobeye Syndicate #0|The Stink-Eye Mob #0|N.E.R.D. Founding Member & #3
    2012 Lightning Red WRX Sedan
    ProcessWest TMIC Cobb SF Intake w/airbox Invidia Catless Downpipe Invidia Q300 Catback Kartboy Short Shifter
    OpenSource tuned by: Matty @ WTF Tuning

  12. #11
    Registered User BANSwee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    cleveland
    Posts
    131
    Quote Originally Posted by zax View Post
    AWD helps with traction, but IT ISN'T MAGIC. You will slide in the snow regardless of drive type. It's simple physics ... you have 4 patches contacting the snow. If you overcome the coefficient of friction your car will slide regardless of whether the car is 4 wheel drive or 1 wheel drive. What can you do? Increase the coefficient of friction... that is, invest in some good winter tires. /thread


    Actually, this is the reason why you see predominantly 4wd cars/trucks in the ditches during winter storms. Drivers apparently think that 4wd has some magic to keep the car on the road. Jesse is right, your best bet is to slow down. Stability control, AYC, limited slip diffs, active center diffs all help maintain control, but they cannot stop the car from sliding when the friction is lost, remember that...

    Just for the sake of a good argument so we can arrived on a theoritecal fact..

    The thing is..,, I have driven a FWD and a real time 4WD and both of them handled the snow quite well. BOTh of them wears an All-season tires.. hmm I can say this is my first to actually drift on snow. I would like to add that I did turn with precaution--in other words slowly! There might some explanation on this full time AWD. One I'm considering is that while FWD is only following the back of the car AWD tends to push it. BUT this should not be the case-- it should give me more precise handling/steering to the intended path..

    I think for now I would put some things at the back of the car.

    (PS. Yes I was alone in the car & nothing of whatsoever at the back..)
    2011 WRX HB in WR blue

    budding audiophile

  13. #12
    The Fruit mangostick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    VB VA .. the ghetto on the sea
    Posts
    4,735
    wait wait wait.. you're complaining about over steer on a car notorious for understeer? ......



    I'm confused...


    However, my confusion aside .. you're comparing (as you accurately mentioned) basically fwd vehicles to a full time awd. Any tire who's traction is broken (spinning or stopped) gives NO directional control regardless of the drivetrain arrangement. Doesn't matter if they're summer or winter or all (3) season tires. The difference between those 3 grades of tire is compound and tread design along with how much/little force it will take to break traction in the conditions they're compared in.
    I dont know any tire that grabs well in 5-8" of snow.. none that will fit a car anyway.

    if your rear tires are spinning the momentum of the cornering car will carry the rear out.. fwd and rear assisted fwd will not handle like that at all because the rear only have enough torque to maintain road speed and aid the primary drive wheels enough to stop them from spinning. They likely wont spin or stop on their own on a fwd or assisted fwd rig.. so.. given that we have 50/50 with brake actuated traction control.. our cars should behave more like a rwd car in a ultra low traction situation like you had in the deep snow.

    Usually the scoobie will push. I'm now very curious to wonder that the changes in front suspension geometry in the 11's has changed how the car likes to react. hmm... things to think about
    OBP 2010 5dr *traded*
    SWP 2013 FRS
    My name is Shawn, I'm a Devout Practicalist and I'm addicted to flat4's
    This page has had 1,666 visits
    SUCH IS MANGO!

  14. #13
    The Default One SeattleJeremy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    4,488
    Quote Originally Posted by mangostick View Post
    I dont know any tire that grabs well in 5-8" of snow.. none that will fit a car anyway.
    This. End of story.
    Continental Extreme DWS all season tires are good tires (that's what I'm running on my car right now), but your car cannot contend with snow that deep.

  15. #14
    Registered User BANSwee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    cleveland
    Posts
    131
    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleJeremy View Post
    This. End of story.
    Continental Extreme DWS all season tires are good tires (that's what I'm running on my car right now), but your car cannot contend with snow that deep.
    anyways,, yeah sure we can't BUt I guess we have to arm ourselves with information/right technique on driving if ever we have to go out to this kind of weather.
    2011 WRX HB in WR blue

    budding audiophile

  16. #15
    Registered User BANSwee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    cleveland
    Posts
    131
    Quote Originally Posted by mangostick View Post
    wait wait wait.. you're complaining about over steer on a car notorious for understeer? ......



    I'm confused...


    However, my confusion aside .. you're comparing (as you accurately mentioned) basically fwd vehicles to a full time awd. Any tire who's traction is broken (spinning or stopped) gives NO directional control regardless of the drivetrain arrangement. Doesn't matter if they're summer or winter or all (3) season tires. The difference between those 3 grades of tire is compound and tread design along with how much/little force it will take to break traction in the conditions they're compared in.
    I dont know any tire that grabs well in 5-8" of snow.. none that will fit a car anyway.

    if your rear tires are spinning the momentum of the cornering car will carry the rear out.. fwd and rear assisted fwd will not handle like that at all because the rear only have enough torque to maintain road speed and aid the primary drive wheels enough to stop them from spinning. They likely wont spin or stop on their own on a fwd or assisted fwd rig.. so.. given that we have 50/50 with brake actuated traction control.. our cars should behave more like a rwd car in a ultra low traction situation like you had in the deep snow.

    Usually the scoobie will push. I'm now very curious to wonder that the changes in front suspension geometry in the 11's has changed how the car likes to react. hmm... things to think about

    It was really oversteer as per wiki (oversteer is the condition when the slip angle of the rear tires exceeds that of the front tires. Oversteer occurs when the rear tires reach the limits of their lateral traction during a cornering situation but the front tires have not, thus causing the rear of the vehicle to head towards the outside of the corner). I just want to make sure that I was defining what happened.

    The feeling at that moment is that, is was more rear biased car rather than 50/50 power distribution. Happened twice, but basically I was a maniac on the second one because I was just trying to make fun on drifting.

    I did correct it by not applying anything (i.e. brake, acceleration..)
    2011 WRX HB in WR blue

    budding audiophile

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Quick Reply Quick Reply

Register Now

Please enter the name by which you would like to log-in and be known on this site.
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.

Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Please enter a valid email address for yourself. We strongly suggest that you stay away from using aol, yahoo, msn, and hotmail accounts. Sometimes the mail server blocks the emails from our server. As a result you will not receive any notifications including the confirmation email.

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.


Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •