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This is a discussion on Factory Five 818 (WRX-based, mid-engined kit car) within the New Cars/Prototypes Forums forums, part of the Community - Meet other Enthusiasts category; According to my friend (cause I'm too lazy to look it up) there wouldn't be much problem with registering it ...

  1. #16
    and the Funky Bunch Calvinball's Avatar
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    According to my friend (cause I'm too lazy to look it up) there wouldn't be much problem with registering it in PA.
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    Factory Five 818 (WRX-based, mid-engined kit car)

    Quote Originally Posted by RayfieldsWRX View Post
    You'd register it as a "custom-built vehicle" in NC; I've had to investigate it for my buggy. I can't speak for other states, but if there's any place that won't let you build that, while simultaneously allowing cars on the road with no driver, it would be California.
    That's my bet too though I'm unsure. As a side note, I look forward to cars without drivers. I drive a lot and there are two things I dislike about that: driving, and drivers. Getting rid of both in one step would be brilliant.
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    Administrator RayfieldsWRX's Avatar
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    Yeah, I was really just being snarky. I'm fascinated with autonomous car tech, and I think I may be fine with sharing the road with them...assuming it's implemented well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD_GR View Post
    That's the thing: for a kit, it's very reasonably priced. However once you've built it, you can't actually drive it on the road. So it's a $15K track car that needs a $5K used truck and a $1K used trailer to get back and forth from the track events that can cost, what?, about $500/day all said, without fresh rubber? It's both affordable and expensive at the same time.
    Just use the title from the donor WRX. The only hiccup in that in Cali is finding someone to smog it, but there are ways.

    In Cali they have a "kit car" title but they only hand out ~250 a year so you have to be on your game. You also need to smog them I believe to the year of the motor.

    Quote Originally Posted by mycologist View Post
    This has been my dream build for years - 1300 pounds, RWD, dedion, tube frame, mid engine, EJ compatible.

    More like $30K though



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    I thought people got these kinds of things registered all the time?
    One of my best friends business partners has one. He bought it used for $20,000. It needed a little interior sorting, (couple wiring issues, finishing touches) but the paint was done, and it runs good. I rode in it, damn those things are small, you'd better be comfortable with your passenger. His had a vw motor out of a van. He registered it here in Cali as a "kit car".
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    Factory Five 818 (WRX-based, mid-engined kit car)

    To use the WRX title you need enough of the WRX around though, wouldn't you? The smog cert does have to match the motor - in fact that is the only legal way to fit a catless up pipe in CA: transplant the entire motor from the later car, but with all the latter's smog kit, meaning you'd have to carry over the air pump. I think a new chassis in CA would be a chore whereas a Beetle would be smoother sailing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD_GR View Post
    To use the WRX title you need enough of the WRX around though, wouldn't you? The smog cert does have to match the motor - in fact that is the only legal way to fit a catless up pipe in CA: transplant the entire motor from the later car, but with all the latter's smog kit, meaning you'd have to carry over the air pump. I think a new chassis in CA would be a chore whereas a Beetle would be smoother sailing.
    Can you remove the motor from the car, yet leave the chassis lying in your front yard?
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    Factory Five 818 (WRX-based, mid-engined kit car)

    Quote Originally Posted by zax View Post
    Can you remove the motor from the car, yet leave the chassis lying in your front yard?
    Better ask Jimmy about that one...
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    Factory Five 818 (WRX-based, mid-engined kit car)

    Hah! I bet there are rules about that too.
    WRX Info Links, Courtesy TheJ
    Man is a brute.... If you're cruel to him, he respects and fears you. If you're kind to him, he plucks your eyes out. Alexis Zorbas
    I lied. I cheated. I bribed men to cover the crimes of other men. I am an accessory to murder. But the most damning thing of all... I think I can live with it. And if I had to do it all over again - I would. Benjamin Sisko
    DISCLAIMER: Opinions expressed are the author's alone and are inherently worthless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SD_GR View Post
    To use the WRX title you need enough of the WRX around though, wouldn't you? The smog cert does have to match the motor - in fact that is the only legal way to fit a catless up pipe in CA: transplant the entire motor from the later car, but with all the latter's smog kit, meaning you'd have to carry over the air pump. I think a new chassis in CA would be a chore whereas a Beetle would be smoother sailing.
    You would have a fair amount of the wrx in the new car and the only time it would get questioned was when you were pulled over, or for smog. In my mind its no different really than an extensive mod like a T-bucket, tube chassis baja bug, extensive offroad rig like a Toyota, Jeep, moon buggy etc. Hell in the off road world, it is very common that every component but the VIN plate gets replaced with something else over its life, and even that gets removed and reapplied.

    I know people in the past were buying old titles for 32 roadsters and such to title their 32 kit cars.

    To me what gets sketchy is swapping over the VIN plate. It is technically not legal, but is what would be required for it to be legal. Then you just have to carry over all your smog components from Evap, etc.

    And technically to be legal, anything that has extensive fab work like custom hot rods, anything with engine swaps, etc., needs a Final Stage Vehicle Manufacturer Label to be road legal per the feds, or "special construction" titling which then you have to show proof to the DMV via an inspection.

    I actually do Final Stage Vehicle MFG Labels at work all the time since we buy incomplete Cab/Chassis and up-fit them.

    Its a gray area for sure, but you can take comfort in the fact that 99.9% of LE have no clue about most rules in the CVC. They all carry a laminated cheat sheet that is a "hit list" of the most common tickets. They'd be soo confused, that unless you had commited a felony they'd kick you loose.
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    Factory Five 818 (WRX-based, mid-engined kit car)

    I believe it.

    Ship of Theseus fraud is rarely enforced it seems. I think that hot rod guy with the TV show got busted, but the average Joe won't be. I think the show was "American Hotrod" years ago.
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    Man is a brute.... If you're cruel to him, he respects and fears you. If you're kind to him, he plucks your eyes out. Alexis Zorbas
    I lied. I cheated. I bribed men to cover the crimes of other men. I am an accessory to murder. But the most damning thing of all... I think I can live with it. And if I had to do it all over again - I would. Benjamin Sisko
    DISCLAIMER: Opinions expressed are the author's alone and are inherently worthless.

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD_GR View Post
    Ship of Theseus fraud
    Excellent philosophical segue!
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  13. #27
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    I think CA officials are following the more western philosophy that if the ship has had all it's parts replaced, it's not the same ship. I found a link to the guy and the Ship of Theseus fraud case:

    Garrett, Jerry (February 27, 2008). "Boyd Coddington, Hot Rod Hero, Dies at 63". New York Times. Retrieved April 26, 2010. In 2005, he was accused of fraud by the State of California for titling his custom-fabricated creations as "antique cars" to avoid emissions controls and tax obligations.

    http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2008...ro-dies-at-63/

    So that would be an issue for a CA owner wanting to use a Subaru VIN for that kit. I don't know if there are other routes one can take to legalize it. I'm sure the maker has run into this before since so many people, and so much money, come from CA.
    WRX Info Links, Courtesy TheJ
    Man is a brute.... If you're cruel to him, he respects and fears you. If you're kind to him, he plucks your eyes out. Alexis Zorbas
    I lied. I cheated. I bribed men to cover the crimes of other men. I am an accessory to murder. But the most damning thing of all... I think I can live with it. And if I had to do it all over again - I would. Benjamin Sisko
    DISCLAIMER: Opinions expressed are the author's alone and are inherently worthless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SD_GR View Post
    I think CA officials are following the more western philosophy that if the ship has had all it's parts replaced, it's not the same ship. I found a link to the guy and the Ship of Theseus fraud case:

    Garrett, Jerry (February 27, 2008). "Boyd Coddington, Hot Rod Hero, Dies at 63". New York Times. Retrieved April 26, 2010. In 2005, he was accused of fraud by the State of California for titling his custom-fabricated creations as "antique cars" to avoid emissions controls and tax obligations.

    Boyd Coddington, Hot Rod Hero, Dies at 63 - NYTimes.com

    So that would be an issue for a CA owner wanting to use a Subaru VIN for that kit. I don't know if there are other routes one can take to legalize it. I'm sure the maker has run into this before since so many people, and so much money, come from CA.
    This is how you can above board do it, and what my buddy did with the porsche kit:
    California DMV Registration for Custom Built, Kit Cars, & More at DMV.org: The DMV Made Simple

    Basically you have to prove you own it, pass a brake and light inspection, the get a BAR referee to sign off on it. Not impossible, but not fun either.

    I have friends with several BAR'd cars and each case is unique depending upon the referee. The BAR Referee will cut down on the cool factor as they require all emissions systems components from the old car to be used virtually in their entirety. This includes EVAP canister and system, Air box from donor vehicle, stock or approved exhaust components, sensors, etc.
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  15. #29
    He simply abides. SD_GR's Avatar
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    That sounds like what my friend had done to a Canadian car. I had heard the stuff about fully intact emissions components before too. Thanks for the link, it's very interesting.
    WRX Info Links, Courtesy TheJ
    Man is a brute.... If you're cruel to him, he respects and fears you. If you're kind to him, he plucks your eyes out. Alexis Zorbas
    I lied. I cheated. I bribed men to cover the crimes of other men. I am an accessory to murder. But the most damning thing of all... I think I can live with it. And if I had to do it all over again - I would. Benjamin Sisko
    DISCLAIMER: Opinions expressed are the author's alone and are inherently worthless.

  16. #30
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    I couldn't seem to find the thread where someone was asking about converting to FWD for this application. I was curious to see if there was any progress there, because this car interests me. Oh well, this is just as good a place as any to post this up. I read this review a little while back and figured I'd share.
    Factory Five Racing 818 First Drive - Driving the Factory Five 818 Powered By Subaru - Road & Track



    Also, I couldn't help but relate to this statement a little bit given your recent unfortunate recent situation.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rambo View Post
    If my bugeye meets an untimely death, it might be reborn as one of these some day.
    One evening as I was loading some things into my car, I thought to myself "I should really put things in the trunk more often instead of the back seat in case I get in an accident" Not 40 minutes later I was in the market for a new car. Of course, I never figured I'd actually crash my car and I'm sure you felt the same way. Foreshadowing is a strange thing. I was both thankful for and quite startled by my instance of it.
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