Turbo up grade.
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This is a discussion on Turbo up grade. within the Engine Modifications forums, part of the Tech & Modifying & General Repairs category; Hey guys I'm upgrading to a vf39 turbo for my 05wrx because I want to hit 300 whp. I already ...

  1. #1
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    Turbo up grade.

    Hey guys I'm upgrading to a vf39 turbo for my 05wrx because I want to hit 300 whp. I already have a Turbo back exhaust and a catless uppipe. What all do I need to replace when putting in the new turbo?

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    Registered User WRX-maniac's Avatar
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    You will need bigger injectors, I would say for your setup 650-750cc injectors and they should even give you a little head room, 255lph fuel pump, electronic boost control solenoid, I think you will also need a new turbo inlet(not to sure about that, ill let somebody else chime in on that if im not correct but I think a new turbo inlet is needed), and a pro-tune.
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    Dang bro your killen it! Nice mods !! And thanks for the advice!

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    Let us know how u go and the progress. It'd be interesting to know as maybe in the near future I might consider something similar

    Melbourne's most Notorious... Rexy driver. if you have GD fog light cover or sti spoiler or exhaust thrn please let me know. thanks

  6. #5
    Registered User Impreza2.0's Avatar
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    Do you already have the compressor?
    The vf39 has a few issues you should be aware of before purchase, and the supporting modifications you will need to make it perform as it should are more than listed in this thread so far.

    two issues about the car:
    suspension
    brakes

    issue about your desired turbocharger assembly:
    the housing is prone to cracking, especially if the compressor is run hard and often.

    the cures:
    make sure your rotors, pads, lines, and fluid are in GOOD shape. Closer to new the better.
    reason - you are about to double the power the car is capable of producing, you need to be able to control that, one of the ways that has to happen, you must be able to STOP! Stopping 300hp takes more brake power.

    There is no cure for history. The vf39 is inexpensive and easy to find, mainly because people who own one want something bigger or more durable. It CAN crack, that doesn't mean it will. Just make sure when you buy it that you have a chance to inspect it, and ask the seller about cracks or little marks that might indicate a crack. See if you can get the seller to promise it will perform upon installation.

    The modifications you will actually need to make this work:
    Larger intercooler. An STi unit will be sufficient, can be bought used pretty cheap. Make sure it has no leaks.
    Larger injectors. You don't need those massive 600+ injectors.
    You need STi pink injectors, and see if you can get a matched set. Make sure if you have side feed injectors that you buy side feed injectors. Adapting top feed to a side feed isn't worth the hassle.
    You will need an up pipe and a down pipe.
    You will want at the very least a panel filter replacement for the OEM airbox, if not an upgrade to the intake. CAI is not going to give you more than a shortram, so save some money.
    You will need a larger fuel pump, Walbro 255lph is sufficient.

    The reason for not going right over to giant upgrade parts like injectors:
    huge flow rates are harder to tune for.
    you want to keep the fueling near to the demand from the system, so that the linearity and smoothness is still there as it is now.
    too large of an injector and your fueling will lack precision.
    too small, and of course it will lean out and not provide the power you want.

    next... suspension. You are about to have 300hp. When you get on an exit ramp, the car leans a bit.
    Imagine that with twice the power. Swaybars at a minimum to keep the car under control.

    when you buy your intercooler, consider an upgraded bypass valve. The stock unit is good for systems up to 21psi. You are looking for around 24psi on 2 liters to generate 300bhp. The OEM bpv will not be able to handle that. It will either leak or rupture. Forge, Greddy, Cobb, TurboSmart.. all good. Make sure it vents back into the system, and is not a 'blow off valve'.

    I'm glad you asked questions and didn't just dive in and find this stuff out later.

    Lastly, your clutch......
    the stock clutch is good to 300hp... but that's it's limit.
    ask more of it than that, and you are likely to glaze the flywheel (much more heat on 300hp than 172hp).
    there are some reasonable options in the clutch department, we can discuss that... but your reaction to what I wrote will have some impact on what I recommend.

  7. #6
    Registered User Impreza2.0's Avatar
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    One thing I didn't mention and it needs coverage:

    your engine tuning...

    How do you want to tune this car?
    Do you want complete control all on your own?
    Do you want a tuner to help or to do the work?

    You have a lot of options in this department, but you must choose one.
    If you are having the installation performed by someone else, you should discuss this.

    Your ECU is programmed to deliver a certain amount of fuel to the engine based on a certain amount of air flow. With larger injectors and pump, and without tuning, your engine will constantly receive too much fuel (run 'rich'). To make the fuel useful, the computer must be told to generate air/fuel ratios that are useable.
    This requires software and hardware that is specialized.

    some of the tools we use:
    reliable laptop with a constant power source (plugged in only, never on battery)
    Tactrix cable (this is how the laptop connects to the car)
    Cobb Accessport v1-v3 are useable on your year and model

    the laptop/cable method requires an understanding of your engine that I cannot assume I am teaching here.
    the accessport is a 'plug-n-play' device, you do not need to be as educated about the motor to make this work.
    It will allow you to use the car with the new modifications without a long process of tuning.

    the laptop will teach you more, but potentially allow you to make mistakes.
    the accessport will not be able to tune the car as precisely right away, you will need to communicate with a tuner at some point to smooth out the programming it provides.

    You are looking at at least $1500 in upgrades. I don't want that to slow you down, you don't have to have it all immediately...

    Pump, Intercooler, Up Pipe...

    Injectors, turbocharger, downpipe...

    you can do this in stages so it doesn't kill your wallet.

    the work is worth doing, it will bring a new life to your car if you respect the power you are creating.

  8. #7
    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    These are pretty much the main parts you'll want:

    255Lph fuel pump
    larger injectors (talk to your tuner)
    better boost control (ebcs, ewg, etc...talk your tuner)
    ...a tune (possibly an engine management device, talk to your tuner to see what they use. But you should already have this considering your current mods)
    larger intercooler, STi intercooler at least.

    There's tons of vf39 swaps out there, so you should have no trouble seeing what everyone else is doing. Find yourself a reputable tuner in your area using the regional boards on here and on NASIOC and talk them up about it, get some quotes etc.

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    Thanks guys for all your help! We'll I already have a catless up pipe and down pipe so that makes a little difference in what I have to spend! Lol is this a pretty common upgrade to do for wrxs? Do you guys recommend like brembo brakes or just better pads, rooters and lines? I don't want to kill the wallet I just want to make sure my cars built right and safe.��

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    Subaru Newb MainFrame's Avatar
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    Very common.


    If it were me, I would get ID725 injectors, a GM 3-port EBCS, Walbro 255 fuel pump, Process West TMIC, and get a good custom tune. As far as brakes, good pads (Hawk HPS), with good fluid (ATE TYP 200), on good sticky tires will go a long way. There shouldn't be any need to upgrade rotors or calipers on a street driven car (if you're racing that's a different story). Stainless steel lines should improve the "feel" of the brakes, are cheap, and easy to install.

    Suspension wise, being an 05, I would assume the struts are already pretty worn out.. so it would be a good idea to replace them at the very least.

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    Ok cool with all this input I can right set up together now! Thanks everyone! And although it's an 05 only has 65000 miles on it! And I think I'm going to put tein coilovera on it

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    Subaru Newb MainFrame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 05'Franco View Post
    Ok cool with all this input I can right set up together now! Thanks everyone! And although it's an 05 only has 65000 miles on it! And I think I'm going to put tein coilovera on it

    Tein coilovers do not perform all that well on the track, and are extremely harsh and uncomfortable to have on the car on the street. There are much better options for the money.

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    Oh thanks I didn't know that!

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    Master Baiter EJ257's Avatar
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    It depends on how you're going to program your ECU to account for the new turbo. If you're using a canned map like the Cobb AP, you should buy exactly what is described in the map notes, and nothing more. If you're going to have someone make a map for you, it would be wise to get their input.

    That said, if a customer came to me asking me to get them ready for a VF swap...

    Quote Originally Posted by MainFrame
    If it were me, I would get ID725 injectors, a GM 3-port EBCS, Walbro 255 fuel pump, Process West TMIC, and get a good custom tune.
    This is solid advice, with the exception that I really don't see a point to the ID725s/ID850s, personally. ID1000s are easy to tune, consistent, and would be easier to sell down the road as your target audience is larger, plus they're the same price as the smaller ones. There are plug&play adapters you can buy or you can splice into the current wiring. For $60, it's your call. Personally, I'd buy the adapters because I'm lazy, but that's not an expense you need to take on.

    GM EBCS is great because it's inexpensive (~$40 for everything), but you have to do some wire splicing. There are plug&play units available that avoid that, but the only real benefit is the install convenience factor and aesthetics.

    Walbro GSS342 is a solid pump, and all you need for a VFXX turbo. Install is only like 45-60 minutes start to finish.

    You can get away with an STI TMIC, but I wouldn't spend too much on one. They're not that much of an upgrade, and aftermarket is superior anyway. On the older cars, Process West or ETS are my usual recommendations.

    To address some things not yet brought up...

    The plastic OE turbo inlet can tear, so it would be wise to have a replacement (preferably aftermarket silicone like Perrin) handy in case it happens, so there isn't downtime while you wait for one. Whether you choose to use it or sell it afterwards to recoup some of your money is your call.

    I like intakes on cars with a VF turbo or larger. It's an additional expense and certainly not necessary, but you're in the 10+whp gain section, especially if you have enough fuel, which you would with the IDs. If you used the aftermarket inlet and buy an intake, you may as well complete the entire tract with a MAF hose if the intake doesn't include one.
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  15. #14
    Subaru Newb MainFrame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJ257 View Post
    The plastic OE turbo inlet can tear, so it would be wise to have a replacement (preferably aftermarket silicone like Perrin) handy in case it happens, so there isn't downtime while you wait for one. Whether you choose to use it or sell it afterwards to recoup some of your money is your call.

    Good idea.. those inlets can be a pain to deal with.

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