Nameless claims catback gains 25hp/12 ft lb; is this possible?
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This is a discussion on Nameless claims catback gains 25hp/12 ft lb; is this possible? within the Engine Modifications forums, part of the Tech & Modifying & General Repairs category; Hello, While working out which exhaust system I want to invest in, I've been in contact with the guys at ...

  1. #1
    Registered User Zitro's Avatar
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    Nameless claims catback gains 25hp/12 ft lb; is this possible?

    Hello,

    While working out which exhaust system I want to invest in, I've been in contact with the guys at Nameless, and they've been nothing short of awesome at answering all my questions and being very customer-service oriented. It's no wonder they are so popular up here in the Northwest where they are based. For those who don't know, they are a smaller company of a few guys who TIG weld all their own stuff right here in Washington; even their own mufflers. Very high quality 100% T304 stainless steel, excellent welds, a very quality product.

    One thing that did throw me off is while discussing whether I should go axleback or full catback, one of the guys I've bee nworking with told me this:

    "Midpipe replacement is actually going to pick up almost 25ft lb of torque and right at 12 wheel horsepower over the 12ft lb and 10hp that the axleback makes. The catback actually can make good power on these cars on its own without a tune - it's just that most people don't invest a lot of R&D into the design of the catback to ensure that it makes good torque and power. "

    This struck me as a bit odd, as all people seem to say on these forums is a catback will not make any power on our cars, it's just a noisemaker. How can this be then? I doubt he's toying with me with the reputation for integrity Nameless has, but I'm interested in those more experienced in this arena if these claims seem odd. I was leaning towards going the Nameless route anyways, but if I find that they aren't being totally truthful, I may go a different route. Any help would be appreciated; thanks!
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    Registered User cmayba's Avatar
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    I have heard the same thing about being a noise maker, I'd be very interested in hearing everyone's response. I believe that I have narrowed my choice down to the Nameless 5" muffler 3.5" double walled staggered tips axleback. I was just buying it for a little more rumble however if I gain get a few extra HP/TQ and not have to tune I'd be down with that. More so if the catback doubles HP I could be swayed. I too have heard that their customer service is great! Chime in guy's!

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    zax
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    Personally, I don't believe the statement. Do you see any dyno graphs showing the % increase before and after the install on the same day using the same dyno and correction factor and same map?

    Indeed, the addition of a 3" catback may make +25whp...

    (of course that's running a GT3071R, S2 cams, etc.)

    Notice there's not much clarification?
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    Registered User Zitro's Avatar
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    ^LOL

    It seems like a tall claim to me, so I asked for an explanation as to how they achieve these gains. We'll see what he says. I wanted to order tonight, but he probably won't get back to me till tomorrow. Even still, I'd like to know if anyone over here could explain to me how this could be possible, and why catbacks do not make power on these cars.
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    Registered User wreckingball man's Avatar
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    I don't see that happening without changing maps or tuning for it. It's possible to gain power from a more free flowing muffler, obviously, but not without modifying the tune. But what do I know?

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    Registered User Soobvirgin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zitro View Post
    ...I'd like to know if anyone over here could explain to me how this could be possible, and why catbacks do not make power on these cars.
    I think I read somewhere on here before that the restriction in airflow is not from the cat back. It's in the cat and the downpipe.

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    Registered User Zitro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soobvirgin View Post
    I think I read somewhere on here before that the restriction in airflow is not from the cat back. It's in the cat and the downpipe.
    It's supposed to pretty much all in the DP. So I have no idea how they could manage such a boost with just their catback. I just don't want to completely disregard the claim because Nameless has built a very solid reputation for themselves and know many of their clients personally, so I wouldn't think they'd make crazy claims that are unsubstantiated at the risk of shooting their integrity in the ass.
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    Registered User Soobvirgin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zitro View Post
    It's supposed to pretty much all in the DP. So I have no idea how they could manage such a boost with just their catback. I just don't want to completely disregard the claim because Nameless has built a very solid reputation for themselves and know many of their clients personally, so I wouldn't think they'd make crazy claims that are unsubstantiated at the risk of shooting their integrity in the ass.
    No, I wouldn't disregard their claim. But, like Zax, I wouldn't believe it unless they can show you documented proof. Especially if no other manufacturer is able to produce similar results with their own product.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zitro View Post
    So I have no idea how they could manage such a boost with just their catback.
    Quote Originally Posted by zax View Post
    Indeed, the addition of a 3" catback may make +25whp...

    (of course that's running a GT3071R, S2 cams, etc.)

    Notice there's not much clarification?
    Again, to reiterate... no one is claiming that the car is stock besides the catback. If the catback IS the restriction, you bet your ass a freer flowing exhaust will pick up extra power even without a complete retune.
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    Registered User Soobvirgin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zax View Post
    Again, to reiterate... no one is claiming that the car is stock besides the catback. If the catback IS the restriction, you bet your ass a freer flowing exhaust will pick up extra power even without a complete retune.
    This makes a lot of sense. And that way they can make their claim without it being false. It just may not apply to everyone's car.

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    Registered User Zitro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zax View Post
    Again, to reiterate... no one is claiming that the car is stock besides the catback. If the catback IS the restriction, you bet your ass a freer flowing exhaust will pick up extra power even without a complete retune.
    Either you edited your first post, or I TOTALLY missed the last part since I was laughing at the photo lol. But I should have clarified; he made this claim based on a stock vehicle, as we were discussing my car in particular.
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    I absolutely do not believe that claim. As has been mentioned, the largest restriction in the exhaust the the stock downpipe. Without a re-mapping there is no way there will be a 25WHP/12WTQ gain with only the addition of a catback exhaust on a stock wrx.

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    Registered User Zitro's Avatar
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    ^This is what I'm feeling. It really has boiled down to spend more and get the quality Nameless piece or save and go TurboXS catback. I was leaning towards Nameless but if I find they are pulling my chain, that in and of itself is enough to make me order the TurboXS out of principle. Hard to sell me on paying more for your customer service if you are making bogus claims.
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    Master Baiter EJ257's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zitro
    ^This is what I'm feeling. It really has boiled down to spend more and get the quality Nameless piece or save and go TurboXS catback. I was leaning towards Nameless but if I find they are pulling my chain, that in and of itself is enough to make me order the TurboXS out of principle. Hard to sell me on paying more for your customer service if you are making bogus claims.
    I wouldn't say that they are "pulling your chain", but rather giving you a sales pitch. I would not expect 12whp / 25wtq out of a catback as a bolt-on part on a stock car. You gain power by making your car a more efficient air pump. The more air a car can flow through the motor, the more power it will make. On a custom tuned S2 car, I could possibly see maybe a 10whp gain from a catback.

    I have never seen it done either with datalogs or with a dyno (but honestly, I've never really looked), but I'd be curious to see what the difference on a completely stock car the stock catback vs open downpipe would be. If open downpipe (READ: no restriction from the catback) doesn't provide that kind of results (while keeping things within the scope of the tuning parameters), I would say it's safe to assume no catback would.
    Last edited by EJ257; 10-02-2013 at 06:09 PM.
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