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This is a discussion on Viper hunting? within the Comparison: WRX vs World forums, part of the Community - Meet other Enthusiasts category; i really dont think you need more whp than a viper to beat it. I know most vipers weigh around ...

  1. #16
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    i really dont think you need more whp than a viper to beat it. I know most vipers weigh around 3500 pounds, so atleast we have a slight weight advantage. I think its possible for a wrx with around 400 at the wheels to hang or possibly beat a viper.

    Weight


    Gen#3 RT/10 3410 WRX 3100 dif of 310 Lbs

    RWHP 450 Stock WHP 400 Stage 4 with a 2.2
    or 2.5 conversion
    Weight to HP Ratio 7.5 LBS per HP 7.75 LBS per HP

    You are riht on the money. The WRX should win that race due to it's gearing and AWD advantage. But a 350 WHP WRX will loose.
    Last edited by Drod; 05-17-2004 at 01:20 PM.

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  3. #17
    Registered User SGOSWRX's Avatar
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    Its definately the awd advantage that wins the race. Thats how I beat Z06s and thats how I beat this Viper.
    He didn't stand a chance in a short race up to 85mph or so. Most Vipers/ Z06s can't run those mag stats at the track. Some can but many just spin their tires all the way through first gear.

  4. #18
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    Originally posted by SGOSWRX
    Its definately the awd advantage that wins the race. Thats how I beat Z06s and thats how I beat this Viper.
    He didn't stand a chance in a short race up to 85mph or so. Most Vipers/ Z06s can't run those mag stats at the track. Some can but many just spin their tires all the way through first gear.
    yes, I agree that off the line, many 300-350whp awd cars will give more powerful cars hell..

    From a roll on race though, I am not so sure... I guess it is all in the power to weight ratio as has been mentioned above I guess...
    02 WRX WRBP sedan..
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  5. #19
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    more like power to drag coeficcient.
    Mods

    Armed with a rotated Precision 6265 turbo at 35psi and a built 2.5 liter.

  6. #20
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    To keep the record staight, I dont even post on SVTperformance any more. Have not for a year.
    -----------------

    I have given more respect to the STi than any other car. Pound for pound, dollar for dollar you can not get a more fun and exciting car.

    However, I dont consider exhaust and filter a "mod." So a 2003/4 SRT-10 Viper with 520 WHP is about a 1:6.5 HP to wieght. Again, this car is 0-60 in 3.9 stock and grabs VERY well with massive rubber. Even a crappy driver can take an Sti. Not to mention it traps about 20 MPH faster...

    Hey, we all go over this all the time. "Horsepower costs money. How fast do you want to go?"

    I could make a Yugo beat an SRT-10. But exactly how many Sti's are on the street taking SRT-10 Gen 3 Vipers? Maybe 1, maybe 2.... Maybe none...

    You would have to do things to the STi that would make its resale value crap, be illegal on the street, and probably KILL the longevity of the car to make it that fast....

    The Gen 3 Vipers are fast. You will see times of VERY low 11's and I would be a high 10 with a couple of minor tweeks.

    Another thing to consider: The STi comes pretty much maxed out. It takes a lot to sqeeze out more performance. Not as bad as others, but the SRT-10 Viper is VERY choked. You can unleash WAY more HP/TQ out of that V10 than you could ever dream with the STi.


    To each his own....



    03 EB Expedition
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  7. #21
    Registered User SGOSWRX's Avatar
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    Originally posted by 03Cobra
    To keep the record staight, I dont even post on SVTperformance any more. Have not for a year.
    -----------------

    I have given more respect to the STi than any other car. Pound for pound, dollar for dollar you can not get a more fun and exciting car.

    However, I dont consider exhaust and filter a "mod." So a 2003/4 SRT-10 Viper with 520 WHP is about a 1:6.5 HP to wieght. Again, this car is 0-60 in 3.9 stock and grabs VERY well with massive rubber. Even a crappy driver can take an Sti. Not to mention it traps about 20 MPH faster...

    Hey, we all go over this all the time. "Horsepower costs money. How fast do you want to go?"

    I could make a Yugo beat an SRT-10. But exactly how many Sti's are on the street taking SRT-10 Gen 3 Vipers? Maybe 1, maybe 2.... Maybe none...

    You would have to do things to the STi that would make its resale value crap, be illegal on the street, and probably KILL the longevity of the car to make it that fast....

    The Gen 3 Vipers are fast. You will see times of VERY low 11's and I would be a high 10 with a couple of minor tweeks.

    Another thing to consider: The STi comes pretty much maxed out. It takes a lot to sqeeze out more performance. Not as bad as others, but the SRT-10 Viper is VERY choked. You can unleash WAY more HP/TQ out of that V10 than you could ever dream with the STi.


    To each his own....





    Are you trying to say a 500+hp Viper is faster than a 300hp STi?
    Why would anyone think such a thing?

    But I dought there are too many stock Vipers running 1.66 sec 60' times.
    The 03 Cobra that I raced that was trapping 116 mph took more than half the track to catch me. So a well driven STi can definately beat a Viper in a short race. (but it must be short)

  8. #22
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    SGOSWRX,


    My brother has a New RT 10 and he has raced many STI's on the street and the track. The STI definitely has the advantage of the line, but he has timed 1.77 60 ft times. You seem to be lucky and maybe ran some RT 10 drivers that depend on the cars power rather than driving skills. He has never lost to an STI or a Stage 4 WRX in the 1/8, but they have given him a dam good run. Hell, I beat an STI in my Stock WRX running 15.5 PSI. I ran a 13.8 and he ran a 14 sec 1/4. You seem to be a good driver, and seem to squeeze all the performance out of your STI.

  9. #23
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    My modded 03 Cobra was very close to a Gen 2 GTS:

    12.0 @ 118 with a 1.89 60' on stock rubber.

    Now if I, average driver, can pull a 1.89 in a Cobra, what can your "average driver" pull in a Viper? They have much better grip.

    The STi can perform very well off the line, however, it has about the same amount of rubber to the pavement. One stock Viper tire is about the width of 2 stock STi tires. Sure you are applying power to 4 tires with the STi and 2 with the Viper. But you are really applying power to about the same amount of friction or road surface. The STi has a slight advantage.

    But even if you take a Viper in the 60' by 1/10th or even 2/10ths, you will get KILLED in the 1/8th and sluaghtered in the 1/4....

    Again, anything can happen on any day, anywhere.... I just feel TOO MUCH is given to the STi "off-the-line" and not enough given to how much faster the SRT-10 really is than the STi. I would bet money the new SRT-10 can hang right there in 60' times with the STi. You take to professioanl drivers, they would be close. Its just easier to get any jerk-meat driver to get the STi to produce a nice 60'. I still think its not that hard to get the Viper to produce a very good 60' as well. 60' do not win a race BTW.





    03 EB Expedition
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    03 Cobra
    1/4 - 12.05
    MPH - 118.06
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  10. #24
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    BTW: I also think its kind of funny to compare a SRT-10 (or any Viper) to a Subaru WRX STi.

    They are both built for different purposes. The STi does not compare in looks or power. And who cares if the STi will beat the Viper in dirt or snow... Thats NOT the point.

    Personally I would much rather be driving a slow SRT10 than a fast STi, anyday...

  11. #25
    Registered User Red Rocket's Avatar
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    Originally posted by 03Cobra
    To keep the record staight, I dont even post on SVTperformance any more. Have not for a year.
    -----------------

    I have given more respect to the STi than any other car. Pound for pound, dollar for dollar you can not get a more fun and exciting car.

    However, I dont consider exhaust and filter a "mod." So a 2003/4 SRT-10 Viper with 520 WHP is about a 1:6.5 HP to wieght. Again, this car is 0-60 in 3.9 stock and grabs VERY well with massive rubber. Even a crappy driver can take an Sti. Not to mention it traps about 20 MPH faster...

    Hey, we all go over this all the time. "Horsepower costs money. How fast do you want to go?"

    I could make a Yugo beat an SRT-10. But exactly how many Sti's are on the street taking SRT-10 Gen 3 Vipers? Maybe 1, maybe 2.... Maybe none...

    You would have to do things to the STi that would make its resale value crap, be illegal on the street, and probably KILL the longevity of the car to make it that fast....

    The Gen 3 Vipers are fast. You will see times of VERY low 11's and I would be a high 10 with a couple of minor tweeks.

    Another thing to consider: The STi comes pretty much maxed out. It takes a lot to sqeeze out more performance. Not as bad as others, but the SRT-10 Viper is VERY choked. You can unleash WAY more HP/TQ out of that V10 than you could ever dream with the STi.


    To each his own....



    Here's the problem - you're purposely trying to make a uneven comparison. No kidding the newest, best, fastest Viper with a couple bolt-ons will beat a stock STi....duh.

    The spirit of this thread is to figure out what would make a close race against a viper, or edge one out. Not the newest best viper, a common one such as a 97-02 GTS.

    I also disagree that the STi is maxed out - the turbo is pretty maxed out, but people are still pulling 12.3-4's with it. With a bigger turbo+bolton's, people are seeing 150 whp gains on pump gas. Pretty good.

    Kevin
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    XS500/UTEC/UR 785cc/MRT TMIC/3" Catless/AVO Turbo inlet/APS 70mm CAI/AVC-R/JIC FLT-A2/SSR Type-C

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    ~450 bhp

  12. #26
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    I have to disagree with you. The WRX is a difficult car to launch. The car lacks the low-end torque of most V8s, so you need to launch them at high RPMS. If you drop below the power band during a launch the WRX will bog and the result is a crappy 60 ft time. I have been racing cars for years, and find the WRX a temperamental little pain in the ass car to launch. In most cases, I can manage a 1.8 60 ft time in my stock WRX, but I have seen 2.0 on many occasions. My brother has a 2004 RT 10 and I believe, that any meathead can manage some good , but place the car in the hand of a skilled driver and you will see different times. The majority of Viper owners use these cars for weekend cruises and rarely engage in any type of racing. The Viper is one bad car, but it can be beat. My brother raced a GT 40 Kit car with a 302 CID 400 HP and got his ass handed to him.

  13. #27
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    I also disagree that the STi is maxed out - the turbo is pretty maxed out, but people are still pulling 12.3-4's with it. With a bigger turbo+bolton's, people are seeing 150 whp gains on pump gas. Pretty good.

    That's with significant upgrades. We are talking FMIC, Engine Management, TB, UP and Intake. But yes the car has plenty of potential. I have seen 470 WHP STI's with the listed mods and bigger turbo.
    Last edited by Drod; 05-18-2004 at 11:42 AM.

  14. #28
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    I still think even with your 470 WHP STi against a 520 WHP Viper, you would struggle and still possibly loose.

    Why?

    Because the power to weight will be close BUT the TQ will not. You might have 470 WHP but you are probably in the neighborhood of 320 WTQ. The VIper is more like 550+ in TQ. That will propell that beast WAY faster. Certainly you will give one a nice run in the first 1/8, but it will progressively get worse the faster you go and the longer you stay in it....

    Besides how many times will you have some seriously MAXED out STi against a SRT10 Viper? Not many... Even if the odds turn out such that they meet on the street, who's gonna road race a SRT10 Viper?

    I would personally be DAMN happy to edge out C5 Vettes. And maybe catch a crappy driver in a Z06. Thats PLENTY to brag about...
    03 EB Expedition
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    03 Cobra
    1/4 - 12.05
    MPH - 118.06
    465 RWHP
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  15. #29
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    I like cobras but refuse to believe a modded cobra could hang with a 600 or 750cc bike. If you have beaten such bikes(which a 600cc might be possible if you have a good deal of money in your car), but running a 12 sec 1/4 is not even going to get you close to todays 600s. New 600s are running low to mid 10s at over a 130, pretty much comparable to 750s of a few years ago. I do like cobras though. Ok, I'm off my soap box now.

  16. #30
    Registered User BassMan097's Avatar
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    The only viper experience I've had was recently, this past weekend. It seems like every sunday the rich dudes take their toys out for a spin on the major highways around here...anyway, it was a mid-late 90's model (the one with the side pipes), and to my surprise the driver was pretty young (20's), and he was the one that picked the race. We went from a 40 mph roll, i pulled about a half car through 3rd gear, then about a full car by the end of 4th. I was surprised that I could hang with it from a roll, but that gen i think only came with 400 hp, so the numbers were actually in my favor. From a dig I probably would have beat him by a lot more...When I get a real tune with the AEM I should be around 410-420 whp on pump gas, and then I can *attempt* to run the current gen vipers and see how close I can come to them. But honestly, racing those things from a roll with awd is like pissing in the wind. On a real 1/4 or in a street race from a dig, its much more even...
    2004 R32: 220 whp

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