I want to build an all-motor Civic HB
+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 21

This is a discussion on I want to build an all-motor Civic HB within the Comparison: WRX vs World forums, part of the Community - Meet other Enthusiasts category; I know a lot of our members came over from the Honda camp, so I was hoping I could get ...

  1. #1
    Registered User PlatinumWRX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    6,581

    I want to build an all-motor Civic HB

    I know a lot of our members came over from the Honda camp, so I was hoping I could get some help in a project that I might take on in the near future: an all-motor Civic hatchback.

    Questions:
    What year/model Civic or CRX is the best to start with? (Lightest, Stiffest, Easiest to motor swap, etc.)
    What engine is the best for an all-motor? (non-turbo, MAYBE nitrous for non-NHRA events)
    What is involved in obtaining an engine? (sources, engine codes, cost)
    How hard is it to get the non-VTEC JDM DOHC (that I hear so much about)?
    Who makes the best parts? (rods, pistons, valve, cams, etc.)
    How much can I expect this to cost me? (not all that important, just ball-park some stuff for me)

    TIA,

    -Jim

  2. Remove Advertisements
    ClubWRX.net
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    123
    you must check out http://hybrid.honda-perf.org
    go to the archives......
    i'm guessing you'll want a 92-95 civic cx hatch with a B18C motor....i sold my 92 si to buy the wrx...kinda miss it now and then...until boost kicks in!
    Mark
    02 WRX Wagon

  4. #3
    Registered User All8up's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Ashburn VA
    Posts
    530
    despite what hybrid honda will tell you...the H22 (190-200hp, 155-160pds of tq) is the best motor for an N/A build up. The typical H22 powered civic will run 13s @ 100+mph (that's w/o any mods). There are a variety of companies that manufacture motor mounts to accomidate this engine into a 92-95 civic.
    You should look for an OBD1 H22 (m.y. 93-96 are most common).
    OBD1 cars always put more power to the ground and are more responsive to any mods.
    As far as the components for the engine....
    Crower stage 1-3 cams, crower retainers, springs. (Skunk and JUN also make cams as well). This in conjunction with the typical I/H/E set up will put over 190 to the ground in OBDII form and will put over 210 hp to the ground in OBD1 form.
    If you move on to higher compression pistons (OEM type S, other brand names escape me at the moment) will put down an additional 10%.
    There's a lot more to this project, but hopefully I gave you some insight.
    e46 M3 (new toy)
    02 wrx w/257 swap (now sold)
    IS 300 5spd w/ NAV (hers)

  5. #4
    Registered User PlatinumWRX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    6,581
    Thanks for your advice guys. I'm sure that there is more coming from the other Honda guys on here.

    All8up, You definitely pointed me in the right direction. I'm going to start looking for a car ASAP.

    -Jim

  6. #5
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    San Diego, Ca
    Posts
    13
    2000 Civic Si
    Lighter then stock, enhanced by N20, and driven WELL.

  7. #6
    Registered User SilverX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Herndon, VA
    Posts
    96
    Originally posted by All8up
    despite what hybrid honda will tell you...the H22 (190-200hp, 155-160pds of tq) is the best motor for an N/A build up. The typical H22 powered civic will run 13s @ 100+mph (that's w/o any mods).
    Its the best and most powerful N/A motor yes but you wont like the way the car drives with it. Its just too heavy. I would get a b16 or 18 and add a little FI
    New:
    2005 Electric Blue Lancer Evo VIII

    Traded:
    Platinum Silver 02 WRX
    TurboXS stage2

  8. #7
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Dublin, OH
    Posts
    86
    he said all motor....

    personally I'd start with a 98 or 99 and get a ITR drive train if you can find one

    spoon rims, body kit, red recaros, CTR steering wheel and meter, HID, Spoon coilovers, 5 lug hubs from either a CTR or ITR (maybe they're the same... don't know a ton about it), Spoon or Toda internals, Mugen or ARC exhaust

    it's all about JDM especially with the hatches... look soooo sweet

  9. #8
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    314
    An all motor civic HB will not be cheap to build. I say you are MUCH better just by modifying your wrx.
    To get real power, you will need a H22A swap (prelude engine.) Most of the people do B16A tho. In any case, you are looking at 10 grand (including the car) to make it go into 13's. Not worth it in my opinion.

    Or.. you can buy a WRX engine and try and stuff it in a CRX..

  10. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    San Diego, Ca
    Posts
    13
    Originally posted by jk147
    An all motor civic HB will not be cheap to build. I say you are MUCH better just by modifying your wrx.
    To get real power, you will need a H22A swap (prelude engine.) Most of the people do B16A tho. In any case, you are looking at 10 grand (including the car) to make it go into 13's. Not worth it in my opinion.

    Or.. you can buy a WRX engine and try and stuff it in a CRX..
    bull****. my friend built his all motor CRX for 6K INCLUDING the car. It pretty much consists of an H23 short block, H22A head, I/H/E, cams and cam gears. Runs low 13s instreet trim, high 12s on slicks.

    Also, I have another frined running a modified B20B all motor engine. i believe he dynoed it at ~230 WHP. In a 2100-2300lb hatch, that should be good for low 13s easy.

    BTW, Im curious as to why you dont want to go with forced induction. An integra non VTEC LS B18B engine will take to a turbo very eaisly (low compression ratio) and can put out over 300WHP on stock internals. Not to mention its a lot cheaper engine to buy.
    Last edited by JoeB16; 06-07-2002 at 08:19 PM.
    2000 Civic Si
    Lighter then stock, enhanced by N20, and driven WELL.

  11. #10
    Registered User GREDDY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    319
    Here's my opinion since I've had several HB hybrids.

    The lightest would be 88-91 Civic DX hb/CRX(not the SI model).
    92 or newer Civic hb's look better but cost more and weighs a little bit more.
    The best engine would be B16a or B18c/B18c5(best). H22 engine are good for drag racing only, not good for handling at all. The engine sits too low to the ground.
    The hardest part about installing the engine in is the rewiring and VTEC wiring. If you've never done this before it can get very confusing.

    Some of the early 88-91 Civic/CRX's were high 13's and low 14's.
    The 92 and up Civic hb's are hitting low to high 14's.
    These are just straight swaps with bolt on's, no forced induction and complete rebuild(like crowers, rods, port/polish ect.).
    So complete blue print and being built from bottom up can get you into the 11's or 10's depending who builds your car.

  12. #11
    Moderating YOU
    before you had your Subaru!
    Verdugo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Sea-Town, WA
    Posts
    13,307
    I Support ClubWRX
    BTW, Im curious as to why you dont want to go with forced induction.
    I can't speak for Plat here, but I think this thread was spawned by this thread:

    Wrx Vs Supra

    To me, building an all-motor anything is really impressive. If I had the technical skills, it would just be a really fun project to see what I can do with it. It wouldn't be a replacement for my WRX or whatever car I had...it'd just be a project car If I'm thinking on the same wavelength as Plat, that's probably how he feels about it too...
    Armin - ClubWRX Admin/Moderator since 2002
    Senior Editor and Photographer, NWMotiv.com
    Photography Portfolios: ArminAusejo.com | ArminWeddings.com
    President, Project One Car Club
    02 WRX "EVA-00" | 2010 A4, still to be named | 02 M3 "M-Thrizzle" (traded in) | 08 STI "Blaze" (sold)
    djrez4 is a genius | ScoobyDMC #010

  13. #12
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    123
    and BTW, before I sold my 92 si I was planning on dropping in the B18C...$3500 for a USED motor if you could find one....plus $1000 for the install ........but I figured by the time I get it all together I could easily dump 10k (I/E, etc...) into a car that was worth $2500....not a very wise move from a financial standpoint....i sold the civic with 200k miles...leaking oil like crazy, worn out clutch, faded paint, exhaust leaks, ac that barely worked......for $3350 turned around and bought the wrx.....just made better sense to me to put a little money into a new fast car than to lose it putting it into an old clunker, i think you stand a better chance of getting some of your mod money back from a newer car if you were to sell.....what a thought...sell the wrx? ......just my $.02
    Last edited by mark5211; 06-08-2002 at 12:10 AM.
    Mark
    02 WRX Wagon

  14. #13
    Registered User All8up's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Ashburn VA
    Posts
    530
    Originally posted by SilverX


    Its the best and most powerful N/A motor yes but you wont like the way the car drives with it. Its just too heavy. I would get a b16 or 18 and add a little FI
    My friend (who has several hybrid civics) said the H22 only weighs 75pds more than the B18C. His car seems to handle fine. His real problem is not handling, it's getting traction. The H22 has come a long way now, there are just as many options for that motor as the B series motors.
    e46 M3 (new toy)
    02 wrx w/257 swap (now sold)
    IS 300 5spd w/ NAV (hers)

  15. #14
    Registered User PlatinumWRX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    6,581
    Originally posted by Verdugo
    I can't speak for Plat here, but I think this thread was spawned by this thread:

    Wrx Vs Supra

    To me, building an all-motor anything is really impressive. If I had the technical skills, it would just be a really fun project to see what I can do with it. It wouldn't be a replacement for my WRX or whatever car I had...it'd just be a project car If I'm thinking on the same wavelength as Plat, that's probably how he feels about it too...
    You have spoken for me very well, Armin.
    My WRX is my daily driver. I am most likely going to do and uppipe next and be done with it. I think it is absolutely futile to try and make my WRX super fast because their are SO many people around here that have WRX and WAY TOO MUCH money to spend on them. Add to this the fact the I don't want mad HP in my WRX, but rather drivabilty for work days, track days, and rally days. My WRX will soon be receiving an uppipe, upgraded brakes, sway bars, and new wheels and tires. A roll cage, seats, and harnesses aren't far behind. Then I AM DONE.

    The Civic will be street legal and I want to run in the all-motor NHRA class, so it has to be SUPER FAST with a roll cage and as much HP as I can cram under the hood. I'd also like to be able to put the car in "street trim," and go F-up some hot shot punks that just don't know. For this, nitrous will be employed. The difference between N2O and FI is REMOVABILITY.

    Having said all this, can somebody please tell me what all these engine designations mean? I'm assuming B16 is a 1.6L, B18, is a 1.8L, and H22 is a 2.2L, but again I'm Honda-clueless .

    -Jim

  16. #15
    Moderating YOU
    before you had your Subaru!
    Verdugo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Sea-Town, WA
    Posts
    13,307
    I Support ClubWRX
    Originally posted by PlatinumWRX


    You have spoken for me very well, Armin.
    My WRX is my daily driver. I am most likely going to do and uppipe next and be done with it. I think it is absolutely futile to try and make my WRX super fast because their are SO many people around here that have WRX and WAY TOO MUCH money to spend on them. Add to this the fact the I don't want mad HP in my WRX, but rather drivabilty for work days, track days, and rally days. My WRX will soon be receiving an uppipe, upgraded brakes, sway bars, and new wheels and tires. A roll cage, seats, and harnesses aren't far behind. Then I AM DONE.

    The Civic will be street legal and I want to run in the all-motor NHRA class, so it has to be SUPER FAST with a roll cage and as much HP as I can cram under the hood. I'd also like to be able to put the car in "street trim," and go F-up some hot shot punks that just don't know. For this, nitrous will be employed. The difference between N2O and FI is REMOVABILITY.

    Having said all this, can somebody please tell me what all these engine designations mean? I'm assuming B16 is a 1.6L, B18, is a 1.8L, and H22 is a 2.2L, but again I'm Honda-clueless .

    -Jim
    w00t I was right! heheh

    As far as the engine designations, I don't know what the letters mean, but you're right about the numbers. I'm also fairly certain that B16 comes out of a Civic, B18 is out of an Integra, and H22 is out of a newer Prelude, but I have a feeling you already knew that...heheh
    Armin - ClubWRX Admin/Moderator since 2002
    Senior Editor and Photographer, NWMotiv.com
    Photography Portfolios: ArminAusejo.com | ArminWeddings.com
    President, Project One Car Club
    02 WRX "EVA-00" | 2010 A4, still to be named | 02 M3 "M-Thrizzle" (traded in) | 08 STI "Blaze" (sold)
    djrez4 is a genius | ScoobyDMC #010

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Quick Reply Quick Reply

Register Now

Please enter the name by which you would like to log-in and be known on this site.
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.

Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Please enter a valid email address for yourself. We strongly suggest that you stay away from using aol, yahoo, msn, and hotmail accounts. Sometimes the mail server blocks the emails from our server. As a result you will not receive any notifications including the confirmation email.

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.


Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •