Has anyone ran a mustang GT-500??? - Page 4
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This is a discussion on Has anyone ran a mustang GT-500??? within the Comparison: WRX vs World forums, part of the Community - Meet other Enthusiasts category; Originally Posted by GraysonSubaru I am not arguing the fact about the race or anything..i simply dont care about that ...

  1. #46
    Registered User Juice33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraysonSubaru View Post
    I am not arguing the fact about the race or anything..i simply dont care about that aspect of it. that is like my stage 2 wrx trying to race a C5.

    i do not agree that it is a $42k car. An item is valued at what people pay for it. what it is built to be can always be different from what it ends up being. Some cars tend to end up being more than originally priced -- this mustang is a good example while others (anything Isuzu sells) are far below was was set as the initial value from the factory.

    value is what people pay for it...regardless of what the place/people that built it figured value to be.

    Xbox when it came out is a good case of this as well.

    EDIT: does anyone on here actually pay MSRP or NADA retail for a vehicle? I never have...so to me that $25,000 + MSRP WRX is really worth $23k that it can be bought for.

    price is directly related to perceived value. if noone feels that the price placed is more than they value it, they simply dont buy it and that is how rebates/incentives come about. if eveyone thought that MSRP was the end all be all value of something, they would always pay that and not negotiate, look for a rebate, etc. they would feel that the item was worth exactly what was being asked of it.

    You could value any car as a $10 car because you hate it and it is a worthless pile to you, but it was still built to standards that reflected it's original price. The car comes from the factory built as a $42000 car, we are not talking about modded cars or baseball cards and what we perceive them to be worth. You cannot argue that Ford and SVT built the car for a specific purpose at specific costs. Any dealer mark-up has nothing to do with the materials used or the machinery to build it or the cost of parts that were used for the engine. If I got to a dealership and tell them I perceive the GT500 to be valued at $25,000, they will say good for you and tell me to take a hike.

    What happens next year or the year after (when the fervor dies down), when they are selling for sticker and there is no more mark-up? Are they still considered $62,000 cars by you or are they then considered to be a $42,000 car?

    Bottom line, it is a $42,000 Muscle car that is very impressive for its price (so impressive that dealers are asking fo $20k+ over sticker) and has a ton of modding potential. Probably more modification potential (to a certain cost point) than just about anything else available right now. It is what it is.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffbmx00 View Post
    my friend has a 5.0 too, they are slow, the only way to decently make them fast is to drop a v8 explorer engine in them.

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  3. #47
    GraysonSubaru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juice33 View Post
    You could value any car as a $10 car because you hate it and it is a worthless pile to you, but it was still built to standards that reflected it's original price. The car comes from the factory built as a $42000 car, we are not talking about modded cars or baseball cards and what we perceive them to be worth. You cannot argue that Ford and SVT built the car for a specific purpose at specific costs. Any dealer mark-up has nothing to do with the materials used or the machinery to build it or the cost of parts that were used for the engine. If I got to a dealership and tell them I perceive the GT500 to be valued at $25,000, they will say good for you and tell me to take a hike.

    What happens next year or the year after (when the fervor dies down), when they are selling for sticker and there is no more mark-up? Are they still considered $62,000 cars by you or are they then considered to be a $42,000 car?

    Bottom line, it is a $42,000 Muscle car that is very impressive for its price (so impressive that dealers are asking fo $20k+ over sticker) and has a ton of modding potential. Probably more modification potential (to a certain cost point) than just about anything else available right now. It is what it is.
    of course they will tell you to take a hike because their cost is more than that...that is just business.

    the car is worth what people will pay.

    i am not saying it isnt a good car or the performace isnt impressive. i have friends that race mustangs and their business revolves around modding them.

    and yes, the stang is right now a $62,000 car because that is what it takes to buy them (or whatever price they bring) and when the fever goes away and they go to sticker (if they do), then it will be a $42,000 car. goes back to it is worth what people will pay.

    perception means value...and it may vary greatly by person depending on what it is, how it can help them or improve their lifestyle, driving experience, etc.

    why does anyone buy one product over another, sometimes because of the value they place on the product, sometimes it does not do/fit what they are looking for.

    do you pay MSRP for everything you ever buy? Probably not. i dont think any of us on here have paid retail for any vehicle, new or used.

    that mustang could be bought for well over sticker and turned around and sold for that same amount. Solstice models have been doing it since they came out. sometimes you can buy a new one cheaper than a used one...
    Last edited by GraysonSubaru; 11-29-2006 at 12:43 PM.
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    Hey, being the forum car ADD guy is better than being the forum OG.
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    Well nobody cares what you think, Seth

  4. #48
    Registered User Juice33's Avatar
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    You are still not getting it. It is a $42,000 level car, no matter what anyone pays for it. It is not about percetion, perception means nothing in this conversation. You can buy the car for $42,000 if you try, if you are lazy and don't look hard then you will pay $62,000. If you are going to be stubborn with your perception argument then fine be like that. Your argument about paying MSRP has nothing to do with anything, I am not talking about paying MSRP and no one else is either. The car's price is $42,000, that is price range/class that the car should be compared to. It was not meant to be compared to $60,000 cars (just outperform them). It is a Mustang, it is not a luxury car like a Mercedes, nor is it a sports car like a Vette. The car was meant to compete in the $42000 range of performance cars.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffbmx00 View Post
    my friend has a 5.0 too, they are slow, the only way to decently make them fast is to drop a v8 explorer engine in them.

  5. #49
    GraysonSubaru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juice33 View Post
    You are still not getting it. It is a $42,000 level car, no matter what anyone pays for it. It is not about percetion, perception means nothing in this conversation. You can buy the car for $42,000 if you try, if you are lazy and don't look hard then you will pay $62,000. If you are going to be stubborn with your perception argument then fine be like that. Your argument about paying MSRP has nothing to do with anything, I am not talking about paying MSRP and no one else is either. The car's price is $42,000, that is price range/class that the car should be compared to. It was not meant to be compared to $60,000 cars (just outperform them). It is a Mustang, it is not a luxury car like a Mercedes, nor is it a sports car like a Vette. The car was meant to compete in the $42000 range of performance cars.
    can you find a brand new one for $42k???? if so, buy it and put it on ebay and make some money.

    yes i was meant to compete in the $42k price range, but supply/demand has put it in another category for now.
    Quote Originally Posted by RayfieldsWRX View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikie13 View Post
    Well nobody cares what you think, Seth

  6. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by subyguy View Post
    i know that a regular wrx wouldnt do it....so i was wondering if any STI owners out there have gone against this beast???
    on another note:
    I wouldnt think many have even seen one, let alone ran against one since they are still pretty few and far between....

    figured id add that back on topic since it seems like the other part of the thread is kinda stuck and neither of us are making headway in swaying one anothers thinking about the value thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by RayfieldsWRX View Post
    Hey, being the forum car ADD guy is better than being the forum OG.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mikie13 View Post
    Well nobody cares what you think, Seth

  7. #51
    Registered User Juice33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraysonSubaru View Post
    can you find a brand new one for $42k???? if so, buy it and put it on ebay and make some money.

    yes i was meant to compete in the $42k price range, but supply/demand has put it in another category for now.

    It may be in another price range, but it is still in the same category.

    And if I could afford to buy another car and pay $42k for the GT500, I would buy it in a heartbeat and keep for myself, forget re-selling it, I want it!
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffbmx00 View Post
    my friend has a 5.0 too, they are slow, the only way to decently make them fast is to drop a v8 explorer engine in them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GraysonSubaru View Post
    on another note:
    I wouldnt think many have even seen one, let alone ran against one since they are still pretty few and far between....

    figured id add that back on topic since it seems like the other part of the thread is kinda stuck and neither of us are making headway in swaying one anothers thinking about the value thing.

    There was one at my local track the last 4 or 5 times i went. As far as looks go it really didn't look much different then a regular GT I was not impressed with how it appeared, I didn't see it run, but i was told it was in the high 12s, i know he filled up with race gas cause i was in spec right next to him.
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    I think they are cool cars and that they are worth around $40k for what you get. I am kind of disappointed though that the exterior styling is too bland, IMO. I read a few months ago in C&D or Motor Trend that the base 400HP C6 beat one in every test, which is proof that the car is about 400-500 lbs too heavy...
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  10. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juice33 View Post
    You are still not getting it. It is a $42,000 level car, no matter what anyone pays for it. It is not about percetion, perception means nothing in this conversation. You can buy the car for $42,000 if you try, if you are lazy and don't look hard then you will pay $62,000. If you are going to be stubborn with your perception argument then fine be like that. Your argument about paying MSRP has nothing to do with anything, I am not talking about paying MSRP and no one else is either. The car's price is $42,000, that is price range/class that the car should be compared to. It was not meant to be compared to $60,000 cars (just outperform them). It is a Mustang, it is not a luxury car like a Mercedes, nor is it a sports car like a Vette. The car was meant to compete in the $42000 range of performance cars.
    The market determines price, not the manufacturer. This is a capitalistic society and we run the market. You're a sucker if you buy a Speed 6 for MSRP.

    However, I do agree that it should be compared to the $40k class and not the $60k.
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  11. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bboy AJ View Post
    However, I do agree that it should be compared to the $40k class and not the $60k.
    That is all I am trying to say.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffbmx00 View Post
    my friend has a 5.0 too, they are slow, the only way to decently make them fast is to drop a v8 explorer engine in them.

  12. #56
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    Exclamation

    I understand that but, really if you had $40k or even $20k I think I would still buy something like a Rex, STi, or Evo before ever considering buying a GT-500. But that's me and I know everyone's different

  13. #57
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    Coming from a ford owner for many many years... they will never in a million years make a car that can beat the Ford GT or even come close. Ford categorizes their cars. They make this mid size sedan to compete w/ the other mid size sedans. They make the retro mustang to compete w/ all camaro's and firebirds and challengers yet will never try to go as far as competing w/ the Z06. No way, it's in a different class, why would they aim for that. Just like the Focus is in the Honda Civic class. They'll never take the Focus and try to make it compete w/ the WRX... that's just dumb to try and dethrone something outside it's class.

    Subaru takes a car and creates it's own class... ford expands on an age old class that's going to be in the sh!tter in a couple of years. No one wants fwd sedans and all that crap anymore. They want awd sedans and if you're gonna make a coupe, make it awd or rwd. Fwd is obsolete.
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  14. #58
    Registered User Juice33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LegacyMyth View Post
    I understand that but, really if you had $40k or even $20k I think I would still buy something like a Rex, STi, or Evo before ever considering buying a GT-500. But that's me and I know everyone's different
    Hey, we can't all be fanboys and only buy AWD 4-bangers for life!

    Quote Originally Posted by powder View Post
    Coming from a ford owner for many many years... they will never in a million years make a car that can beat the Ford GT or even come close. Ford categorizes their cars. They make this mid size sedan to compete w/ the other mid size sedans. They make the retro mustang to compete w/ all camaro's and firebirds and challengers yet will never try to go as far as competing w/ the Z06. No way, it's in a different class, why would they aim for that. Just like the Focus is in the Honda Civic class. They'll never take the Focus and try to make it compete w/ the WRX... that's just dumb to try and dethrone something outside it's class.
    Ford won't make a car faster than the Mustang GT (outside of the SVT offerings) so the Focus and everything else suffers because of that. Ford could bring the Cosworth Focus or whatever the AWD turboed 4 banger is called in europe over here, but it would be faster than the Mustang GT and eat up the MGT sales. Ford needs to just go balls out with the Mustang GT so that they can really step it up with the Focus and other cars. That would rock, but probably won't happen any time in the near future.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffbmx00 View Post
    my friend has a 5.0 too, they are slow, the only way to decently make them fast is to drop a v8 explorer engine in them.

  15. #59
    Registered User LegacyMyth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juice33 View Post
    Hey, we can't all be fanboys and only buy AWD 4-bangers for life!
    I know, but I might

  16. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juice33 View Post
    Hey, we can't all be fanboys and only buy AWD 4-bangers for life!



    Ford won't make a car faster than the Mustang GT (outside of the SVT offerings) so the Focus and everything else suffers because of that. Ford could bring the Cosworth Focus or whatever the AWD turboed 4 banger is called in europe over here, but it would be faster than the Mustang GT and eat up the MGT sales. Ford needs to just go balls out with the Mustang GT so that they can really step it up with the Focus and other cars. That would rock, but probably won't happen any time in the near future.
    Exactly. They don't get that in this day and age, offering 300 hp for under 30k in a rwd whale just doesn't cut it. Chevy is starting to get it. They realize that building the Z06 to take out Ferrari's was the wise choice and then not charging $150k for it was even wiser.

    You're right though. Ford has the platform they need to start taking the market back in the US. They jsut don't get that that's exactly what it will take to get us away from our subaru's and mitsu's (still won't work for me though, i'm sold on suby.).
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