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This is a discussion on A new Civic Si on the horizon within the Comparison: WRX vs World forums, part of the Community - Meet other Enthusiasts category; the rarity of the new si had them selling for upwards of ,000 some places when they first came out ...

  1. #16
    Registered User $lick Rick's Avatar
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    the rarity of the new si had them selling for upwards of $26,000 some places when they first came out

    seeing as how they're only releasing 500 total of these, i predict prices will run well over $30,000

    mugen makes good products, but holy sh@t balls.... that's allot of money for a car with a only a few cosmetic upgrades


    and i HIGHLY doubt that honda will be releasing a f/i sports car any time soon... especially in the US.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ArizonaWRX View Post
    first off, happy halloween everyone!
    TehWRX can outhandle a civic SI, is faster in both 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, and has great everyday handling and can tackle all conditions, including rain and snow for cheaper. PLUS Subaru's dependability and response to mods?
    The WRX actually does *not* outhandle the Civic Si, not on stock tires anyway. And it's also not cheaper.

    WRX TR (cheapest WRX, with no options)- $23,995
    Civic Si Sedan (most expensive Si, completely loaded)- $23,240

    Honda's dependability is as good if not better (hey, the transmissions don't break as easily either). And Si's get ridiculous response to mods as well.

    All that said, I don't disagree, the WRX is still a better car. Just not for all of the same reasons.

  4. #18
    Registered User $lick Rick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skunkers View Post
    The WRX actually does *not* outhandle the Civic Si, not on stock tires anyway. And it's also not cheaper.

    WRX TR (cheapest WRX, with no options)- $23,995
    Civic Si Sedan (most expensive Si, completely loaded)- $23,240

    Honda's dependability is as good if not better (hey, the transmissions don't break as easily either). And Si's get ridiculous response to mods as well.

    All that said, I don't disagree, the WRX is still a better car. Just not for all of the same reasons.
    he's comparing the supposed cost of the mugen civic to the cost of the wrx. the mugen will probably run close to $6-7k more than the base wrx

    it's true that the si responds well to mods, but after the basic i/h/e and something like kpro or hondata you'll need to do decent motor work or f/i to see any more real gains. though i/h/e and tuning should put you into the low 14's with a very slight few seeing high 13's

    tires being equal, the wrx will outhandle the si, though the mugen will have a different suspension which might narrow the gap. but add any inclimate weather and the wrx will eat the civic for lunch thanks to awd

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    Quote Originally Posted by $lick Rick View Post
    the rarity of the new si had them selling for upwards of $26,000 some places when they first came out

    seeing as how they're only releasing 500 total of these, i predict prices will run well over $30,000

    and i HIGHLY doubt that honda will be releasing a f/i sports car any time soon... especially in the US.
    In all honesty, that was the first year of the new Si. All cars are harder to get at MSRP/invoice in their first year. Things are quite different now in most places, and will be different again in spring+ 2007. Dealer price is a huge variable on any car due to location, demand, bargaining, equity, etc. I'm not argueing that the prices won't necessarily get out of control, but a lot of people seem to be getting STI Limited's around MSRP. So it depends.

    And regarding Honda's future sports cars, rumors are running high that either the next S2000, TSX Coupe, and/or Integra will be powered by a turbo K23 varient from the Acura RDX. Should be interesting.

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    I'll agree that a stock SI will give the marshallow suspension on the stock wrx a run for it's money any day of the week. Dollar for dollar mod vs mod I dont see how the SI can even begin to keep up. Show me any SI that makes 300 lbs of torque for under 1,500 and I'll crap gold poo for a month. AP and DP and the 06 simple destorys most cars for "street" driving.

    On the roll the SI might be able to keep up but to be honest I very seldom race around the highway at 70+ mphs...call me sane or whatever.
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  7. #21
    Registered User JUICEDUP3's Avatar
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    honda sux!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by $lick Rick View Post
    it's true that the si responds well to mods, but after the basic i/h/e and something like kpro or hondata you'll need to do decent motor work or f/i to see any more real gains. though i/h/e and tuning should put you into the low 14's with a very slight few seeing high 13's

    tires being equal, the wrx will outhandle the si
    True, but that I/H/E, cams, & Hondata Si will walk away from a stage 2 WRX from a roll, and on a road course.

    But from the factory, the tires aren't equal. And the Si's summer tires are a $200 dealer option where as with the WRX, you have to buy your own at likely $80+ per tire.

    Quote Originally Posted by 302@12psi View Post
    On the roll the SI might be able to keep up but to be honest I very seldom race around the highway at 70+ mphs...call me sane or whatever.
    Yeah you're right, but like I said above, on a road course, from a roll does matter.
    Last edited by Skunkers; 11-01-2006 at 05:42 AM.

  9. #23
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    FWD sucks.
    My last car was FWD and will be my last, and I sure as hell am not paying over 20k for a honda civic no matter what it can do. I have respect for them but I dont think it is worth the money that they will ask for this car.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DTR rex View Post
    Tell that to the stock civic si which looks less flashy than a wrx as he beats the wrx around a track.

    Or tell that to the s2000, a sport car icon that produces handling and balance to offset any logical assumption of it being "rice.
    +1

    Honda has always made fun to drive, inexpensive cars, they're just limited by FWD and a poor image because any ricer can afford one.
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  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by AngelBoy View Post
    +1

    Honda has always made fun to drive, inexpensive cars, they're just limited by FWD and a poor image because any ricer can afford one.
    Honda HAS and continues to make SOME cars cars that 'anyone' can afford. Not the two cars you mentioned though. The SI is around 22,000, and the S2k is around 35,000. Ask those into the Honda scene, and the success of the civic and the civic si pushed it, to where it now is a 22,000 car, and the fit is the new capable compact for 12-15K, where the civic used to be. No one thinks the S2K is rice, you quote of "any ricer can afford one" is not true. I don't know too many people in general who can slap down 35,000 for the 2 seater S2k. A fine car, but for 35K, I would go EVO or STi all day long over it.

    Hondas are nice, but I think to refocus on the thread at hand, the civic SI is nice, (I and most of the general public would still prefer a WRX over it though,) this new mugen one might have some slight styling improvements (side skirts, and .6 lowering from the article,) but 30,000 for a FWD civic 4 cyl N/A? 35,000 for the s2k? Nice, but not affordable. Congrats to Honda for making some nice vehicles, but in my opinion, they are both overpriced for what they are. I would rather have the WRX>SI , and EVO/STI>S2k for the same money. Just my 2 cents.
    Last edited by ArizonaWRX; 11-01-2006 at 12:54 PM.

  12. #26
    Registered User cavallino333's Avatar
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    I think the S2K i overpriced too. Good car though none the less.


    I don't think I've ever driven an Si so I can't comment on it.
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  13. #27
    Registered User $lick Rick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skunkers View Post
    In all honesty, that was the first year of the new Si. All cars are harder to get at MSRP/invoice in their first year. Things are quite different now in most places, and will be different again in spring+ 2007. Dealer price is a huge variable on any car due to location, demand, bargaining, equity, etc. I'm not argueing that the prices won't necessarily get out of control, but a lot of people seem to be getting STI Limited's around MSRP. So it depends.

    And regarding Honda's future sports cars, rumors are running high that either the next S2000, TSX Coupe, and/or Integra will be powered by a turbo K23 varient from the Acura RDX. Should be interesting.

    it's true that it's hard to get most cars ast msrp when they're first introduced to the market, but very few cars bring $6k+ over msrp

    the rumors you're hearing are started by kids with high hopes, they have no basis in reality.

    True, but that I/H/E, cams, & Hondata Si will walk away from a stage 2 WRX from a roll, and on a road course.

    But from the factory, the tires aren't equal. And the Si's summer tires are a $200 dealer option where as with the WRX, you have to buy your own at likely $80+ per tire.
    from a roll after 60mph probably, on a road course probably not.
    but "frumaroll" racing is crappy anywho. it's a form of "race" that was made up by people who cant compete in any form of ACTUAL and sanctioned race. bragging about frumaroll wins is allot like the prius owners who brag about their cars being faster than an enzo to 5mph.

    when we take a look at the cost of the mugen civic vs the cost of the wrx, you can buy the wrx and an amazing set of tires and still save yourself $5,000. even with the civic si vs base wrx, if you figure in the cost of the cost of the upgraded tires and the cost of upgrading the wrx tires, you're looking at a price difference of a a hundred or two max. tires are a small cost to realize the vehicles true capabilities.
    Last edited by $lick Rick; 11-01-2006 at 01:59 PM.

  14. #28
    Registered User DTR rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArizonaWRX View Post
    first off, happy halloween everyone!

    Second, WHAT/ Are you kidding me?

    TehWRX can outhandle a civic SI, is faster in both 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, and has great everyday handling and can tackle all conditions, including rain and snow for cheaper. If you are just giving respect to Honda, (which they deserve) or like Hondas is cool, but are you kidding me? I would take my 06 WRX which is cheaper, over ANY civic SI anyday. ( I think that while the civic Si is great and has a stong following as well, most of the general public would make the same choice, WRX>SI.) Sport suspension, AWD, low center of gravity with the flat four, and boost! PLUS Subaru's dependability and response to mods? NO contest WRX for the win. (FTW for those keeping score at home.)

    Please, do us all a favor and learn how to formulate a proper argument. I don't give a crap which car you prefer, I don't give a crap which car the general public would prefer, and I don't give a crap which car has a better 0-60 or 1/4mile time. Every point you just addressed had absolutely nothing to do with my post of the si ouhandling a wrx.
    You are bringing up modability, drag race times, what people would prefer, etc... I am not trying to state in any way whatsoever which car is superior (I drive a wrx instead of a civic for a reason dumbass) but that does not change the fact that the civic si is a better handling car than the wrx.

    Learn how to read, learn how to comprehend, and then learn how to address points in an argument so that you do not seem like an idiot bringing stuff up that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

    Both cars have similar skidpad numbers, while the si slaloms at nearly 4mph HIGHER.
    Granted, the si is on sport tires, while the wrx runs all seasons but that is no ones fault but subaru's.
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  15. #29
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    The S2K is way overpriced and is too small for me, reminds me of a girly Miata. If it were a little bigger I would really like it because it does have a nice design, it's just way too small.

    I actually considered the new Civic Si couple and Acura RSX-S (another small, girly car). The Civic Si seemed a little larger so I looked into it. But having no torque and waiting for the powerband sucked. Yeah, it's lightweight and you'll catch up eventually but I like that low-end "off-the-line torque" more than anything. Driving my girlfriend's RSX and waiting for the powerband sucks.
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  16. #30
    Registered User ArizonaWRX's Avatar
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    Talking

    I simply was stating my opinion and some facts to back up simply that, my opinion. People are allowed and encouraged to do that on forums, to help learn and spread info, as well as have fun discussing cars and topics, such as this. I am not sure why you feel threatened, but your thoughts show lack of maturity and e-thuging reflects poorly on you and the site.

    Back to topic, the topic is about Honda looking to possibly introduce a 30,000 Mugen civic, not just how it handles. I am in agreement with most poeple who have agreed and posted similar thoughts that the S2K is overpriced for what it is, and a 30,000 civic Mugen SI is too much for what it is as well (FWD 4 cyl. N/A).

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