Stock '05 STi vs Another slightly modded '03 Evo
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This is a discussion on Stock '05 STi vs Another slightly modded '03 Evo within the Comparison: WRX vs World forums, part of the Community - Meet other Enthusiasts category; Well, it happened agian. This time versus a fellow co-worker. Last week he purchased an '03 evo for like 18k, ...

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    Registered User A.Castro01's Avatar
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    Stock '05 STi vs Another slightly modded '03 Evo

    Well, it happened agian. This time versus a fellow co-worker. Last week he purchased an '03 evo for like 18k, with 21k miles on it. Great another evo for this small ass town heh jk. I think the evo count is up to like 10 to 1 vs STi's. BUT ANYWAYS. I pass by him yesturday on the main road in town, and he calls me up to meet him at autozone. We meet, I had just finished debadging the WRX IMPREZA, and was chillin. I asked him what the other guy he bought it from had done to it, and all he would say was a tbe, and 650cc injectors, Aftermarket Clutch I also noticed a couple of guages, when i looked inside his car. Well he asks to run and I oblige(sp) so we take off to the empty ass road.
    STi: Pure Stock (90 octane) (Black)
    Evo: 650cc Injectors, TBE, Aftermarket Clutch, some guages (90 octane i believe) supposidly thats all. (Silver)

    Race 1: I had 1 passenger, so did he. I also had a trunk with about 50lbs worth of crap, everything from motor oil, to chemical warfare mobility bag, and laundry.
    We go from a stop with my passenger counting to 3. I launch at about 4.5-5k and we take off. I get only about a fender on him through first, my shift to second (my best gear, I think) he gets the lead back and gains 1 fender at this point I'm like, holy shiz, shift to 3rd, hes still pulling, has about 3/4-1 car on me. At this point I know hes got me. I shift to 4th (around 70-75mph, and his gaining stops.) I start to inch up slowly but surly. By the shift to 5th, Im back even with him, and still gaining inches. By I would say in the middle of 5th is when I get a car back, and he shuts down.

    All in all, that was the best race I have had so far, where the lead had changed, I could not believe I had that Evo on top end I was also surprised he was so damn even, then ripped me at the start, for the lead. After the race We went back to Autozone, and I had told him, how I thought he would start to gain on topend, like the previous evo I raced, and how I thought I would rip him on lowend. He said he knew he would get me lowend but how I would get him topend cause I had more gears I know I have to shift more, but I didnt think he would loose that much power topend, with a free flowing exhaust. But anyways, good Race all in all. And maybe its true, all evo's are slightly different.
    After I get my catless Turbo-back exhaust installed Late, May, do you think I would take him more easily? How much of a difference is a catless free flowin tbe? I know on my friends WRX, we installed the TurboXS high flow tbe, and it was much smoother, with better rpm response. I just hope I will beable to feel the difference if any I hear the STi takes to hp much better from a TBE then the Evo does.
    Last edited by A.Castro01; 05-07-2005 at 11:35 AM.

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    Registered User Padge's Avatar
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    great race... arent you nervous on 90 octane? I would be!!

    Why dont you buy some race fuel to mix with your 90 octane and get some Engine management instead of a TBE?
    Patrick
    2004 Java Black STi
    COBB Stage II
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    Registered User A.Castro01's Avatar
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    after the TBE will prolly come the utec. I just dont have enough money for the utec right now, and the tbe im getting is just a blitz nur spec catback for like 500-600 then a downpipe. I thought if the utec was set so the car could handle the octane, it would make my car loose power? Anyways, the only octane booster toluene?? around here sold at one place, costs like $10.50 a gallon. Which is seriously rediculous.
    Do you think a utec, on a stock STi would have more to gain from, hp and reliability, then a TBE on the car?

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    Registered User SGOSWRX's Avatar
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    Nice, those EVO's guy would never believe it.

    You need to get to the track to see what she runs.

    With a catless exhaust and a Blitz intake your car would kick his butt. I ran
    12.8 @ 105 mph with the above mods on my STi. It actually ran better with the above setup than it did as a stage 2 (utec - untuned base map and TBE). So don't plan on getting a Utec unless your getting your car tuned for it.

    To prove my point, I know a guy with a Utec Stage 2 setup (untuned) and his best 1/4 mile time is 13.1@ 103 mph.

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    Registered User 04wrx4keeps's Avatar
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    You should look into alchohol injection with that nasty 90oct gas you have to use. I've seen kits for it online (i found a few searching with yahoo) and it basically raises the fuels resistence to knocking (rases the oct basically) and would let you drive around on what amounts to race fuel all the time if you wanted, the one kit I looked at 1 bottle of alchohol (like $7-8) will last you like 10 tanks of gas and give you an affective equivilant to running 100oct on boost.
    Cobb Stage 2.5 VF-34 + uppipe
    Best ET so far - 13.1@103 with a 1.81 60'

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    Registered User A.Castro01's Avatar
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    that Alchohol Injection sounds interesting

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    Registered User 04wrx4keeps's Avatar
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    I forgot that I bookmarked one of the pages. This is one kit for the WRX that I found, I seem to remember seeing a few other kits but dont have the links to them. Its a deffinate must if you want to get engine management, check it out: http://www.bnecustoms.com/alcohol_injection.htm I know I'm getting one real soon with my Acess Tunner
    Cobb Stage 2.5 VF-34 + uppipe
    Best ET so far - 13.1@103 with a 1.81 60'

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    fre
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    Good race and i'm never moving to clovis. That's funny that you mention chem warfare bag though. You in the Air Force?
    11.1 @ 131

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    Registered User A.Castro01's Avatar
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    Yeah Im in the airforce stationed at Cannon afb in clovis =\

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    This is the problem with buying a used modified performance car. He has no clue what the car has on it. If he had 650's without engine managment the car wouldn't run worth a crap and would be dog slow. I suspect it is re-flashed if he has no obvious piggyback controler OR he is running stock injectors and the seller lied to him. If he is only lightly moded running larger injectors would be retarded, so I suspect the seller lied to him.

    The reason you didn't blow by him at first is because he was actually able to make the 1-2 shift. Mitsubishi syncros SUCK to the point that most evo owners either do a slow easy shift from 1 to 2 allowing other cars to pass us at that point, or try to shift fast and grind the fu(k out of second gear.... allowing other cars to pass us at that point. The first guy you raced in your last thread has probably learned to do a slow 1-2 shift. The guy you raced in this thread hasn't learned yet, and avoided the grind by pure luck.

    Keith
    Miss the wifes WRX, but love my Ralliart!

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    Registered User A.Castro01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fourdoor
    If he is only lightly moded running larger injectors would be retarded, so I suspect the seller lied to him.
    Keith
    Well come to find out, the owner of the car, and driver now, lied to me. He doesnt only have aftermarket clutch, intake, injectors, and tbe. He forgot to tell me he has a boost controller set to 24lbs of boost, plus has a fuel pump, and is now ready to put in cams, and a bigger turbo. I knew something was up when I didnt kill him from the start. But to catch up and get a car on him topend in 5th, makes me think, either an untuned evo is not any faster then stock, or those evo's around my town, dont take to modding as I hope my car will.
    I'm thinking I can take him though, cause cant shake me once we start to race, I mean with all that stuff I would think he would pull, pull and just keep pulling. Once I get my tbe on I believe I will take him pretty good, until he gets cams and a new turbo. Then its either hydra or utec for me =)

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    Quote Originally Posted by A.Castro01
    Well come to find out, the owner of the car, and driver now, lied to me. He doesnt only have aftermarket clutch, intake, injectors, and tbe. He forgot to tell me he has a boost controller set to 24lbs of boost, plus has a fuel pump, and is now ready to put in cams, and a bigger turbo. I knew something was up when I didnt kill him from the start. But to catch up and get a car on him topend in 5th, makes me think, either an untuned evo is not any faster then stock, or those evo's around my town, dont take to modding as I hope my car will.
    I'm thinking I can take him though, cause cant shake me once we start to race, I mean with all that stuff I would think he would pull, pull and just keep pulling. Once I get my tbe on I believe I will take him pretty good, until he gets cams and a new turbo. Then its either hydra or utec for me =)
    If he is runnin 24 psi boost, larger injectors, high flow fuel pump, and doesn't have engine management of some kind then the reason you beat him is real simple... he's a freaking moron! Larger injectors + stock ECU = pig rich and no power, even with boost bumped up by 5 psi over stock. Without EM is he down at least 50 HP from where he should be with those mods, probably more.... with bad drivability and crappy gas milage thrown in for good measure! If he had EM he would be over 300 wheel HP, without it and those mods he is lucky if he is making 250 at the wheels.

    On my EVO before I got crazy with it I gained 40 wheel HP from engine management and about 2 psi bost bump(I was running 18 stock, bumped it to 20 with manual boost controler), everything else bone stock. The more mods you have the more important the EM becomes on the EVO.

    Keith
    Miss the wifes WRX, but love my Ralliart!

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    Banned TSi AWD's Avatar
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    I believe this story 100%, I just don't get his mods. Adding 660's is just stupid But I bet he won't knock with all that fuel.


    Truth be told if you add a bucnh of boltons to an Evo it won't really do much, just add some power but no what you expect, you REALLY make big power with a tune and a MBC. I think the stock Evo falls into sub 10.0-1 A/F ratio after a while, it is scary. You DO NOT need those big injectors on a stock turbo. My Evo makes big power on them, they are fine.

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    fre
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fourdoor
    This is the problem with buying a used modified performance car. He has no clue what the car has on it. If he had 650's without engine managment the car wouldn't run worth a crap and would be dog slow. I suspect it is re-flashed if he has no obvious piggyback controler OR he is running stock injectors and the seller lied to him. If he is only lightly moded running larger injectors would be retarded, so I suspect the seller lied to him.

    The reason you didn't blow by him at first is because he was actually able to make the 1-2 shift. Mitsubishi syncros SUCK to the point that most evo owners either do a slow easy shift from 1 to 2 allowing other cars to pass us at that point, or try to shift fast and grind the fu(k out of second gear.... allowing other cars to pass us at that point. The first guy you raced in your last thread has probably learned to do a slow 1-2 shift. The guy you raced in this thread hasn't learned yet, and avoided the grind by pure luck.

    Keith

    I have found the secret to shifting 1-2 smoothly in the evo. You simply power shift with a slip of the clutch and it's like an automatic transmission, no stress on the tranny just a bit on the clutch. I went from 11.8 to 11.6 by doing this it's like you didn't even shift the car just keep going with no drop off. Keep in mind I have a triple disk clutch so im not worried about messing it up. It shifts every time though smooth as butter Way better than the hit or miss granny shift that grinds half the time and still has a power drop off.
    Last edited by fre; 05-10-2005 at 08:05 PM.
    11.1 @ 131

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    Quote Originally Posted by fre
    I have found the secret to shifting 1-2 smoothly in the evo. You simply power shift with a slip of the clutch and it's like an automatic transmission, no stress on the tranny just a bit on the clutch. I went from 11.8 to 11.6 by doing this it's like you didn't even shift the car just keep going with no drop off. Keep in mind I have a triple disk clutch so im not worried about messing it up. It shifts every time though smooth as butter Way better than the hit or miss granny shift that grinds half the time and still has a power drop off.
    There are about 1000 different ideas of what a power shift is.... can you elaborate on your method? I have a double plate CF clutch, so a little clutch abuse for consistant shifts is acceptable to me

    Keith
    Miss the wifes WRX, but love my Ralliart!

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